tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post7123250658318194055..comments2024-03-19T11:13:40.642-07:00Comments on A Different Perspective: Project Pounce and MJ-12KRandlehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06333125414889883920noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-84980952868735253642014-12-09T21:25:07.233-08:002014-12-09T21:25:07.233-08:00Kevin,
So if you are right that Doty’s activity w...Kevin,<br /><br />So if you are right that Doty’s activity with Moore and Pratt on the novel wasn’t authorized by his superiors then what of his activities were? Were the Bennewitz related activities authorized? They also involved Moore. What about Doty’s activities with Linda Howe and the effort to sabotage her HBO documentary on UFOs?<br /><br />In short was Doty a rouge agent? For all of these activities or just some of them? <br /><br />I would suggest that there are two other explanations about the end of his Air Force career. First, it is that if he was basically operating under orders, never the less his cover was blown. His name has reached the public and U.S. senators were involved. Doty had become an expendable liability. Second, if he was rouge why didn’t he get kicked out of the service? Perhaps the mess hall job was a way to let him get his pension and perhaps reestablish a new cover for some post-service contract work. <br /><br />To me this seems more plausible but it is just speculation. <br />John's Spacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08241028519082710381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-73169915610077622792014-12-08T06:24:07.334-08:002014-12-08T06:24:07.334-08:00Since this thread is on MJ12 and crashed UFOs, you...Since this thread is on MJ12 and crashed UFOs, you might be interested to know that one of Leonard Stringfield's last reports on crashed UFOs has just been republished as a new edition:<br />http://nickredfernfortean.blogspot.com/2014/12/stringfield-crashed-ufos-back-in-print.htmlNick Redfernhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02198543983413599418noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-65294389913008876792014-12-07T09:13:24.429-08:002014-12-07T09:13:24.429-08:00John's Space -
If you are looking for motivat...John's Space -<br /><br />If you are looking for motivation of Bill Moore, you need to ask him about it.<br /><br />I do not believe that MJ-12 was part of a disinterest campaign. It seems to have been invented by Moore and friends... Moore talked of creating a Roswell document and months later he has one.<br /><br />Moore, with Bob Pratt and probably Richard Doty, wrote a novel long before MJ-12 surfaced in which the contained the story of Project Aquarius which evolved into MJ-12. They even used many of the terms in that novel. It seemed to be the blue print for the MJ-12 documents that were released...<br /><br />And, the EBD reflects the state of UFO research in the 1980s, not what is known today. Or, in other words, things that we believed in the 1980s have been shown to be wrong. There was no Del Rio crash, or crash in the El Indio - Guerrero area of Mexico... Willingham made it up but Moore and his pals believed it then so it had to be included.<br /><br />It's pretty clear where all this originated and while Doty was involved, I don't believe his involvement was approved by shi superiors. Doty ended his military career as an NCO in a Air Force dining hall (mess hall).KRandlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06333125414889883920noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-29074676447474004242014-12-04T18:14:17.521-08:002014-12-04T18:14:17.521-08:00Kevin,
First of all please note that I didn’t say...Kevin,<br /><br />First of all please note that I didn’t say that there was anything authentic about MJ-12. Disinformation = HOAX except that it is an officially generated hoax rather than one that is done for the personal reasons, etc. Let’s say that you are correct that was Moore who produced the Truman memo and the EBD. However, he was working with Doty on other things including Bennewitz op. Doty was an active AFOSI agent at the time and he claims acting under orders. He also denies he created the MJ-12 documents but he may well have inspired Moore and then stood back and let it happen.<br /><br />This would still be disinformation but would at distance from the government. Once this was exposed as a hoax it has to useful outcomes for the cover up. First, it would tend to discredit the idea of a real crash recovery. And, it would sow a lot of discord within the Ufology community. On the latter point it was a complete success.<br /><br />On the other hand Moore has not admitted that he created the documents, right? Yet he has admitted to a lot of other things that he did. If he wrote the EBD why not admit to that too? Perhaps it was just made to look like he did it.<br /><br />John's Spacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08241028519082710381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-3305676805895049942014-12-04T12:03:32.008-08:002014-12-04T12:03:32.008-08:00KRandle,
Thanks for your posts and ongoing attent...KRandle,<br /><br />Thanks for your posts and ongoing attention to the various matters you cover. They are appreciated.<br /><br />You commented above that you suspect it likely that the MJ-12 tale was concocted without official approval. You may very well be correct. I of course could not conclusively say one way or the other.<br /><br />I would be interested to hear your opinions, should you be inclined to give them, on the likelihood that Doty may have been instructed in an official capacity (as he claims) to meet with and present LMH with the highly questionable docs as took place. Similarly, I would be interested in hearing, from your point of view, the likelihood Doty was acting in professional, official capacities during the ongoing Bennewitz saga. Perhaps you might also care to comment on the responsibilities you think the USAF has to officially address the actions of Doty, his activities that took place at the air base with LMH and so on.<br /><br />No right or wrong answers, I just wonder your opinions. They'd be appreciated at your convenience.<br /><br />Thanks.Jack Brewerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05778028283888927074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-61399147740811600392014-12-04T08:14:17.183-08:002014-12-04T08:14:17.183-08:00John's Space -
I do not believe that MJ-12 wa...John's Space -<br /><br />I do not believe that MJ-12 was a government disinformation campaign. Remember, Bill Moore talked about creating a "Roswell" document because he thought it would convince some reluctant witnesses to talk to him. The whole story, written with Bob Pratt and Richard Doty, appeared in a novel, MAJIK, produced BEFORE any of the MJ-12 documents arrived at Shandera' home.<br /><br />It seems likely that Moore, working with Doty, concocted this tale without any official approval. In the end, however, whether it was done officially or by private citizens, the ultimate answer is "HOAX."KRandlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06333125414889883920noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11558306.post-69455140831778127172014-12-03T22:08:31.974-08:002014-12-03T22:08:31.974-08:00The most reasonable view given the facts at hand i...The most reasonable view given the facts at hand is that the MJ-12 documents are fakes. In the Doty action with Linda Howe we have similar fake documents being presented to a member of the media by an agent of the AFOSI. While the creator of the MJ-12 documents is unknown, it isn’t that unlikely that it could have been the same source as documents Doty let Howe read. It is also clear that the document forgeries started appearing in the wake of the original Roswell book. It is also after a many FOIA documents surfaced showing the government hadn’t lot all interest in UFOs after the Condon Commission.<br /><br />So it seems most likely that manipulating public perceptions about the UFO phenomena was the subject of government active measures. So while the details of the MJ-12 documents are false the disinformation effort also indicates that something similar was in fact real. Diverse elements of the government including the CIA, NSA, the military, FAA, NASA, etc is fallowing a common program of denial. Doesn’t it follow that there is some controlling organization that enforces this policy?<br />John's Spacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08241028519082710381noreply@blogger.com