Sunday, October 07, 2007

Semantics and Melvin Brown

In the last few days, I have been involved in a couple of discussions over what has amounted to little more than semantics. People have been concerned about what some words mean and the usage of them. One way to illustrate all of this is to look at the story provided by Beverly Bean, whose father, Melvin Brown told family about his involvement in the Roswell case.

I am using the short section about the Melvin Brown that appeared in Roswell Revisited to help clarify this point. I believe that people reading The Truth about the UFO Crash at Roswell understood perfectly that we hadn’t interviewed Brown himself, but that the information came from family members we did interview. The footnotes provided the information about how we had gathered the data. In fact, it is clear from other sections of the book that the information didn’t come from Brown himself, but from his daughters and wife. Only those with half a brain didn’t get it and there are plenty of people out there like that.

Here’s where we are on this aspect of the case. I wrote in Roswell Revisited that Beverly Bean is a pleasant English woman, who told researchers about her father, Sergeant Melvin Brown (Yearbook picture seen here), who had been stationed at Roswell in 1947. Unlike some of those who have told stories about Roswell, Brown is in the Yearbook (just like a high school yearbook that contains the pictures of about 80% of everyone assigned to the base) that Walter Haut created in 1947. It is a document that allows us to verify that a soldier did, in fact, serve at Roswell during the critical period without having to gather information from the records center in St. Louis.

Like so many of the others, Brown didn’t tell his story to investigators and it didn’t surface until after Jesse Marcel began talking of the crash in 1978. Interestingly, one of the documents offered by Bean to prove her father served in Roswell was an order with several names on it including Jesse Marcel.

In a video-taped interview conducted in England by Brad Radcliff on January 4, 1991, Bean said, "Dad used to tell us this story and he didn’t tell us often."

He told his daughter, according to what she said on tape, that he "had to go out into the desert. All available men were grabbed and they all went out into the desert in trucks where a crashed saucer had come down."

Brown and another soldier whose name he never gave to his daughter, were pulled aside for guard duty. They were told not to look under the tarp in the truck, but Bean said, laughing, that the minute someone tells you that, the first thing you do is take a look. She said that he dad told her, "He and this other guy lifted up the tarpaulin or something..."

She said that she and her sister now argue about the number of alien creatures under the tarp. Bean says it was two, but her sister insists that it was three. No matter now. The point is that Brown described the creatures for them.

According to her, "He said they were smaller than us, not more than four foot tall... much larger heads than we have. Slanted eyes and [the skin was] yellowish."

Bean wondered if he had been scared but he said that he wasn’t. He thought they had nice faces and they looked as if they would have been friendly. According to Bean, he repeated that as often as he told the story, which, over the years was fewer than a dozen times.

Bean, of course, sometimes pestered him for more information. After the release of Close Encounters of the Third Kind, in 1977, she asked him about the movie and how authentic it might be. He said that it was the biggest load of crap he’d ever seen and not like the real thing at all. When she tried to learn more, he told her, "That’s all I can tell you. I can’t tell you anymore."

The late Karl Pflock, in his book, Roswell, Inconvenient Facts and the Will to Believe, complained that Bean’s story was second hand and that neither her sister nor her mother would comment on it. Pflock had to know that both the mother and the other daughter had confirmed the tale because he had access to the video tapes of those 1991 interviews. He is right about this being a tale told by the daughters and wife of the man who lived it. There is nothing that can be done about that. By the time Brown’s name surfaced in the investigation, he had died from complications of various lung diseases, but it is not true that his wife or other daughter refused to talk.

Ada Brown (seen here) added little to the complex tale told by Beverly Bean when she was interviewed on video tape in 1991. She merely confirmed that she too had heard about the crash over the years and that it was something from another world. She seemed a little uncomfortable sharing a secret left by her husband.

Bean’s sister, Harriet Kercher (seen below), on January 4, 1991, was also interviewed on video tape. She had heard her father tell his tales a couple of times when Beverly was there, but there was one incident when Beverly was absent and her father gave her just a little more information.

Kercher, in her early teens said that she was with friends when she saw something flash by. Her friends saw it too, and then, in the distance, that something reappeared and seemed to be coming at them. Kercher said they were frightened by that shiny object but they weren’t far from her house so they ran there, slamming the door behind them.

Her father met them and asked them why they seemed to be in such a panic. Kercher said that her father, after hearing the tale of the shining object, told her, "It’s nothing to be frightened about."
The friends didn’t understand, exactly, what he meant and he told them about the crashed flying saucer, saying that there were a few bodies on it. He provided few new details. He just made it clear that there was something about the creatures that suggested to him that they were not to be feared.

But, as Pflock said, these were second-hand reports and they could be the misinterpretation of the original story... It is not proof, or even a suggestion of proof of something extraterrestrial.

What this shows, simply, as that I have been fair with the reporting of this story. It is clear from this that Brown told us nothing himself. In my previous books, it was clear that Brown had died before any of us had a chance to interview him. By lifting quotes out of context it looks as if I had tried to mislead the reader. The truth is, all the information was there for the reader so that he or she could decide the merits of the information for him or herself.

For those who are interested, I have a few hardback copies of The Truth about the UFO Crash at Roswell available. It listed for $19.95, but I’ll sell them for a mere ten bucks (plus the shipping and handling because I won’t pay the postage and the cost of the envelopes... just five dollars)...

And for those interested, Roswell Revisited is available now from either Glade Press, PO Box 460, Lakeville, MN for 12.95 plus $5.00 for shipping and handling...

Or from me for the same price and shipping and handling...

Or take both for $20.00 and still for the $5.00 shipping and handling. You can find me at:

Kevin D. Randle
PO Box 10934
Cedar Rapids, IA 52410

25 comments:

Bob Koford said...

Thank you, again, for posting your updates, and providing for discourse.

I believe cases like the Roswell case are important because there are several important documents in the Air Force's "Blue Book' material which both hint at, but also clearly point to several sightings of "unknown" objects crashing to the ground. Further pieces of information, save for one, or two mentioned later in time, dealing with the the discovery, and recovery of these objects are NOT in the files.

For instance, in the now well-known "errant rocket" affair (the Oct 12, 1947, not the May incident)we know from the files that it was NOT an errant rocket or missile. We also know from the information that General Homer declared it, in the end, a "meteor"...but there were sovereignty issues in the mix, as well.

In the end, without a case which has multiple witnesses, who can fill in details that are unknown to the investigator prior to the investigation, cases such as these will probably remain an unknown. But there is always a chance, when folks like yourself, or Ryan Wood, or any other investigator might be able to turn something new up.

There are several cases in the Blue Book material, referring to crashed "objects", which beg for further investigation, as they could show a more direct connection to programs in the Air Defense culture, which is of interest to me.

Thanks again,
Bob.

CDA said...

Kevin:

You write that all the information (about the Melvin Brown interviews) is there for readers to decide on the value of his story for themselves.

No it is not.

Timothy Good, in his book "Alien Liaison" p.86-7 tells how he first interviewed Beverly Bean in Jan to March 1988, well before you or Brad Radcliff did. Also, Tim makes it clear that Brown first related the story to his daughters in the late 1970s (in fact it was almost certainly 1980), after Brown had read something in the London "Daily Mirror" about the Roswell case (I am pretty certain this was a review or article about the Roswell Incident book, published in 1980). This is at variance with your own claim in "UFO Crash at Roswell" p.96 that Brown began telling his daughters during the time "when Americans first landed on the moon" (i.e. 8 to 10 years earlier).

So when exactly did Beverly Bean first hear the 'Roswell story'? Do you know? How old was she at the time? How old was her sister? Just little kids maybe?

You have omitted all mention of Tim Good's involvement. How did Brown's story travel from Tim to you ? According to Tim (but I cannot recall exactly where he said it) he passed his interview notes to Len Stringfield. So it seems to have reached you through a few intermediate persons. Who were they?

Who is Brad Radcliff?

Why do you refer to Brown telling Bev Bean whilst "on his deathbed"? (your book p.96). He died in 1986, according to Tim Good. Yet he first told his daughters in c. 1980. Except that you yourself said it was during the moon landings!

Confusion here. Your response please.

Please also shed some light on the daughters' ages at the time, if you can.

I cannot help thinking Brown embellished his Roswell tale to his daughters as a joke. But I concede we can never know for certain.

I love the quote in Tim's book, from Bev Bean about her dad: "He was a smashing bloke and loved his country". Does this make him a reliable witness or just a story teller? Any other "smashing blokes" involved with Roswell? Does the US military have any serving 'blokes' at all?

CDA

CDA said...

Further to my comments on that 'smashing bloke' Melvin Brown. After seeing that article in 1980 the most obvious step to take was to contact the authors (Moore & Berlitz) and tell them his great news. He would then have been a first-hand witness. Since he did not die until 1986 he had six years to add his testimony to the Roswell case, and be a confirming witness.

Instead he chose to tell his daughters the tale and it was 8 years later (!) before they in turn got in touch with Tim Good.

Utterly amazing! What a way to treat an earth-shattering event in which he (Brown) was directly involved. In fact he could have contacted any of the numerous US UFO groups (NICAP, APRO, MUFON) long before then anyway. He did not need the Berlitz-Moore book to rekindle his memory, assuming the event meant anything to him.

Instead he tells his kids a few bedtime tales. What a great witness. What a 'smashing bloke'.
What a shambles!

If there is any part of the Roswell legend that resembles a children's fairy tale, Melvin Brown's story is one that qualifies best.

CDA

Jack said...

cda -

If I had a UFO/alien encounter, I certainly wouldn't go looking for publicity when I know people like you would scrutinize every little word that comes out of my mouth. And to make it even worse, the great majority of people would begin to think of me as a local laughingstock or village idiot.

It's really a no-win situation, so it's perfectly reasonable to assume that someone like Melvin Brown wouldn't seek out some UFO investigators, especially if he was legally obliged to remain silent.

Then again, those that do seek out publicity are probably full of $hit.

KRandle said...

Good Morning, CDA -

According to the video taped interview that I have with Beverley Bean, the story as I have related it is the story as she told Brad Radcliffe. He is a friend of Don Schmitt who agreed to conduct the interviews with Bean, her sister and her mother. The entire interview is on video tape.

I am not responsible for what Tim Good has written, his interviews with anyone, nor can I answer questions about how he conducted his interviews and obtained his information. To get those answers you must go to him.

The information that I have on Bean, et. al. did not come from Good and therefore felt on obligation to mention him. My only discussion with him was a quick one in which he exampled the Roswell Yearbook and assured me that his witness (Brown) was in there.

On his deathbed, Brown related to his daughters some of the Roswell case. He kept telling them there was money in an account in Roswell and he wanted to make sure they got it. He told them about the Roswell crash... while most of what he said was not a revelation, it was a reafirmation of the story.

So, according to the information I have from the source, she first heard the story as I have related it. I really don't want to speculate about what Good was told, but it seems a good explanation is that she mentioned the story in relation to publication of Moore's book because that was just the latest time her father mentioned it.

I do grow tired of your insistence that the world respond to stimuli in the way you believe they would. Moore publishes his book and you believe that Brown and others should have responded by writing to Moore or by calling the newspapers.

Sorry, I just don't buy that. Brown told his family about it but felt no obligation to go further with the story. That you don't like this response is really your problem and not particularly relevent to the discussion.

Pappy Henderson, after seeing the article in, I believe, the National Enquirer, didn't contact the newspaper but merely told his wife and later a few close friends what he knew. Not everyone runs to the newspaper with a their additions to a story, regardless of what you believe.

And, just because you don't believe the story is no reason to assassinate the character of Melvin Brown. Maybe he embellished a tale and maybe he related it as best he could, but you don't really have to attack his daughter's statement about what she thought of her father. In today's world it is refreshing to hear a daughter say nice things about her father.

CDA said...

Melvin Brown claims to have been present at Roswell in July 1947. He provided proof of this to his daughter Beverley Bean, and this was displayed in Timothy Good's book. So far so good.

We cannot say for certain what Brown's reaction to first reading about the story in 1980 (i.e. 32 years later) would have been. But given the nature of the event that Brown, the Roswell Incident authors, and you yourself, claim it was (namely, an ET visit to our planet), put yourself in Brown's position. What would you have done?

Would you have merely made a note of it and told your daughters the story, little by little, embellishing it at times, or would you have immediately contacted the authors (Berlitz & Moore)
and shouted from the rooftops: "I was there and can confirm everything you say"? I know what I would have done, but perhaps you and Brown would act differently. (Of course Brown had every opportunity to notify the various UFO investigation groups long before 1980 anyway, but that it is another matter).

Forget the 'oath of silence' (if such ever existed). The story was out, via the Moore/Berlitz book. Brown was a first-hand witness (so he claims). He had nothing to lose, and a lot to gain, and there was no need for secrecy at this stage as Marcel & others had already let the secret out. If Brown had anything of value to contribute I would certainly expect him to contribute it there and then, and NOT simply tell the story to his daughters (be they teenage or younger) bit by bit, building it into a quite a tale. As I said before, he could have made a useful first-hand witness instead of a secondhand one.

The account Brown gives, or the account Bev Bean gives, is not the kind of story I would expect from someone who had genuine first-hand knowledge of an earth shattering event such as the official discovery of ETs on planet earth.

You may disagree, but that is my position, and I am certain the vast majority of scientific opinion would agree.

Brown had plenty of time to do this (5 or 6 years) but he chose not to.

Had he done so, this would have been a useful, though far from conclusive, step towards supporting the ET claim for Roswell. It would have been something more than merely gossip.

A firsthand witness is always preferable to a secondhand one. Of course he might even then (like Kaufman & Anderson) have turned out to be of dubious value, but at least you and others, as investigators, would have had something better to go on than you have.

I have my own theory of the Brown-Bean story and its probable timeline, but it would be too much to document here. And you would be quite at liberty to reject it, as you certainly would.

And as with Brown or any other witness, the complete lack of hard evidence remains, and always will.

By the way, I was not impugning Brown's character, just joking a bit about his daughter's use of the phrase "a smashing bloke".
In the US this would presumably translate into "A swell guy".

CDA

Jack said...

Melvin Brown's generation, the "Greatest Generation" that fought in World War II, were a different breed I think.

My grandfather fought in World War II and was shot 7 times in France (and survived). He never talked about the war. Ever. In fact, he never really talked about anything substantial at all.

Same situation with my other grandparents. Emotions and feelings were never expressed. They bottled everything up because outward appearances were everything. For reasons I won't get into, I suspect this sort of tight-lipped behavior was pretty pervasive for that generation.

So if I were to put myself in the shoes of someone from that generation, I wouldn't even be able to fathom how he/she might react because he/she likely would be coming from a completely different mindset and hold completely opposite values.

starman said...

The Kercher story is especially interesting and IMO lends further support to the Roswell thesis in The Truth about UFOs and Aliens.

Friend of Mike Brown said...

I have been trying to contact Beverly or Harriet through researchers for some time now without any luck. All I can state is that if they had a brother named Mike Brown (Never been in print) that was in 6th grade in 1970-71 time period and their dad was in the service at that time and they lived in Nothern Michigan for a brief time (Never in print) then I should be able to confirm a small part of their story.

I could give more details if what I stated is true. Otherwise maybe all I heard was a kid's tale about his dad from some other Brown family that just moved into Michigan from New Mexico at that time (1970).

freeasthewind@earthlink.net

Friend of Mike Brown said...

The bottom line is this. Although it goes against the common knowledge of the researchers, Melvin Brown had a son name Mike. Why it has never been mention during interviews is a real mystery. This fact could be verified by some old records somewhere or by people that knew the family.

Friend of Mike Brown said...

This is not a hoax. I strongly believe I met Melvin Brown and his family in 1971. I would like to be proven right or wrong over this matter. There is not one researcher that has been in contact with them for the last 15 years or so. I will give more details to researchers but for the public, the following describes my contact with this family.

http://helendagner.com/viewtopic.php?t=6317

BrownPublicRecords said...

It's been over two decades since the Browns made themselves celebrities on British television with their many interviews. From the beginning in the early 90s it seemed like they were already quite late compared to all the other key Roswell witnesses which was peculiar in itself on timing. In fact it's a good thing that there were many other witnesses to the Roswell Case beforehand otherwise there would hardly be any credibility at all. Granted, Kevin along with the other researchers did verify that Melvin was in the Roswell yearbook so he was indeed there at the time so they had the right person and the Brown family had some other paper artifacts to prove it. Although they might have been very selective on what they did bring forward to the researchers and carved their stories to their liking by that time. It's too bad that the researchers never got a chance to talk to Melvin's twin brother, Marvin before he passed away and was also a retired veteran. Perhaps some things could have been confirmed or at the very least another voice to the stories. The problem lies more on such convoluted and contradictive testimonies from this family that are so head spinning that one must question the credence of any of it before the main controversy of what was exactly Melvin's own claims . It's one thing to try to comprehend what is said and another over the conflicting claims and mind you that this is not even the Holy Grail of the Roswell story itself. They state that Melvin never used the word 'Roswell' by name when he talked about the alien stuff. So they had no idea it was 'Roswell' related until they were in the attic going thru stuff and suddenly discovered some old papers showing he was actually stationed in Roswell and then from there contacted Timothy Good. Or at least that is one tangent they went down with their interviews maybe to explain in lame terms why they came out so late with their story. So what gives here when in another instance they are stating they were making phone calls inquiring on an old bank account number in America written on a paper with their signatures (Ada & Beverly) along with showing ROSWELL (In big print), New Mexico Federal Bank written right on top of the paper from February 1986 (Melvin's last days). Very peculiar and questionable interviews right from the start with the first one showing Ada crying and describing Melvin's last words where he stated he was always 'faithful' to her before going into the Roswell tale itself with her. Through the test of time it has been proven that much of the Browns tales of Melvin are either inaccurate or at the very least the real history of him has been diverted so much and side tracked to say the least. Of course it was easy to do this as the focus was on 'Roswell' itself at that time so maybe no one noticed. They could have said just about anything and it may have went over well at the time. Perhaps the only real motive behind this was hiding some old family secrets along the way or maybe just to steer people away that may have knew the real Melvin from their memories in the service. Whatever the case, things have not been told accurately about him and the interviews still stand today as very peculiar.

BrownPublicRecords said...

It is also strange that not one researcher could ever track down the oldest Brown sister (Melvin & Ada's 1st born from 1950s in Florida). What little the Roswell topic was discussed with Beverly and Harriet supposedly, one has to wonder if the older sister has more to tell. Being the oldest maybe she did not want to be involved with the don't tell everything charade or maybe just the shy one of the bunch. Whatever the case, the world never heard her side of things and she seemed to completely vanish from the Roswell hysteria altogether. Sad state of affairs for sure when researchers are still guessing where Melvin was stationed in England during his later service years. Over two decades have passed and their guesses are still off track which seems to match the description of a 'fable'. To be front about it, there was never any mention of any of the bases where Melvin was actually stationed in England during their interviews. Which was probably planned this way before they came forward as one would have to be almost tongue tied to avoid naming bases or towns in their country. The only exception to this was a wild goose chase tale of Ada meeting Melvin for the first time at a dance at Bovingdon Airfield near her hometown of Hemel Hempstead. She specifically states in her interview that they first met in late 1948 at this dance when he was stationed at this particular base. Although Bovingdon Airfield was well known for its role of uniting British RAF and USAF guests during World War II efforts but that ended right after the war was over. So easily by 1948 and probably 1947 as well, there was NOT any USAF activity at this base and the records show it. Maybe she was just off a few years but that does not appear to be the case either as let's not forget where Melvin was in 1947. The fact of the matter is that Melvin did not lay a foot on British soil or in the whole continent for that matter until a year or two later. What is even more perplexing is that Ada Kyne as she was known back at that time actually married Fred Hoffman in November 25, 1948 which is coincidently around the same time she claims she met Melvin at a dance. If anyone thinks I have the wrong Ada R. Brown, well it's all in public records! In fact Ada's both maiden names, Kyne & Hoffman, show up on Melvin's documents and also elsewhere. This is just the start of so many conflicts with information from their interviews. Although it was over twenty years ago since their story came out and maybe no one cares. It is true though that the weakest link in testimonies is usually the first one judged. Therefore the Roswell case has not been weighed fairly by some probably just due to the Browns not being very convincing, totally incohesive testimony and where some facts don't even line up correctly.

BrownPublicRecords said...

After all of these years, Beverly Bean is finally giving information where her father was stationed in England. She's looking for Melvin's old military friend, George Kelly. It may be too late now though. Had they mentioned 'Chicksands' in their interviews over 20 years ago, they might have made contact with someone that knew Melvin. Melvin retired from USAFSS at Chicksands, England base in the later part of 1964.

http://www.forms.bedford.gov.uk/chicksands/rafchicksands.aspx

BrownPublicRecords said...

Looking back at the Brown interviews from the Doctor Nabs Psychic Talk Show which are still featured on YouTube, it is quite interesting to watch to say the least. They will go into all kinds of details of where Melvin was stationed in the early years, from Texas to Florida and of course New Mexico but as far as England goes, it's all centered around Hemel Hempstead ONLY. This is supposedly where Melvin was stationed during a dance in late 1948 according to Ada although none of his records show it. Beverly will tell the audience that she was born in Hemel (Which is true) but when it got to Harriet's turn to talk, she does not state where she was born.

Hemel is their hometown and it is where they lived, absolutely. The real story though is that Melvin was stationed at several bases in England thru the years but was concentrated most in his later years between Chicksands, England and Kirknewton, Scotland. Although this was avoided during all the interviews, the fact of the matter is that Melvin was constantly going back and forth between these two bases although there is great distances between them. In fact, Harriet was born in Scotland but these details were avoided for some reason in front of the cameras. It's interesting to see now that Melvin's best friend, George D. Kelly, which Beverly is trying to seek on the Chicksand's Alumni site was also stationed at Kirknewton, Scotland as well and around the same time as Melvin was there as shown here.

http://www.rafkirknewton.com/sortedalpha.htm

So maybe it's time to put the new X-files Series to work in real life and try to put some pieces together. If anyone out there can find a veteran that is still alive that has sound mind and good memories that was stationed at either of these bases in the later 1950s and early 60s, please ask them if they knew a Melvin Brown (Brownie). He dealt with the food service on the base from being a cook to a manager and back to cook again. If you inquire with anyone, try not to mention 'Roswell' though as it might throw them off some. Maybe we can try to figure out why this was avoided so much and for so long during interviews.

BrownPublicRecords said...

If one watches closely it becomes evident that the Brown family has something hanging over their heads when they interview and it's something about Melvin and it's not Roswell related but something so important to them that they can't be truthful and completely open about things. It makes their interviews look like a complete train wreck after all these years and knowing the truth on some matters, their lies become much more apparent. They must feel that they have to put Melvin at places he was never stationed and times that are also impossible. There are sure hints of their game plan as well when one goes over these old interviews. Harriet makes a statement that although he was at Roswell at the time in 1947 as she points at the yearbook and says but his military records show he was clearly somewhere else instead. This statement hints at a Government cover up and it's quite disappointing that the researchers never challenged them with this statement because it's simply not true. Here she makes this claim on British television but not one person has ever asked to see these records. There were never any military records that surfaced that back up Harriet's claim and there never will be. It begs the question - Why not? This would surely prove a cover up if such a document did exist. This would had been a smoking gun if there ever was one! So since the Browns had the liberty to just change Melvin's history all around it's easy to further just blame it on a cover up. If anyone ever tries to challenge the Browns with the accuracy of their testimony, they will cry and use emotions in their favor with how dare you ! They will use the excuse that Mom had a nervous breakdown at these locations so we could never discuss them. That is their strategy for not covering Scotland, Chicksands, Germany, etc. etc. or any of the other places he was stationed and just keep him in the comfort zone of within a square mile of Hemel Hempstead at all times during their interviews. It's so bizarre when his own records show otherwise to their claims. Of course the researchers don't want to face up to it so they don't even question the validity of it. There's been so much emphasis on Melvin never returning to United States by the Browns after settling in England that it's awfully suspicious it almost smells funny. If we use reverse logic to this claim for one minute and say hypothetically he actually returned to United States then it may be quite possible that this abandoned bank account that they suggest as part of a cover up was totally make believe and was just a stage prop. The affect plays out that of course he never returned to United States because he left an abandoned bank account over there. To be frank about it, the only thing they have is a piece of paper with some signatures of an account number on it. It actually does look kind of 'make believe' when they show it and describe it. Could have been totally bogus all this time and the fact is that the researchers that tried to help locate record traces of this account for them, NEVER succeeded at finding anything. Not a single trace of any bank account whatsoever. It's easy from there for the Browns just to wave a magic wand and say there's the cover-up in action again.

KRandle said...

BrownPublicRecords -

First, since the Yearbook was created in the summer of 1947 and was sent to the publisher in August, it establishes that Brown was in Roswell in the summer, 1947. Second, in the documents I have is his membership card in the Roswell Army Air Field NCO Club that is dated July 1947... and there are other documents, that are dated from early 1948 through the summer of 1948. This establishes that Brown was not only at the RAAF in the late 1940s, but puts him there in 1947.

BrownPublicRecords said...

Hi Kevin;

You don't seem to understand. I'm not disputing that Melvin Brown was at Roswell in 1947. He very clearly was there and I have his military records that show he was assigned there in 1946, 1947 and a good part of 1948 as well. His records which I received through Freedom of Information Act request very clearly show Roswell, New Mexico. So everything including all the docs that you and Timothy Good received early on agree that he was at Roswell at that time.

My point is that Harriet states in the British television interview that she knows that he was in Roswell also base on the yearbook so she agrees with us on that part but she goes on and states that his military records indicate that he was elsewhere at that time. Go listen to the interviews if you don't believe me. She goes into no further detail about it. So where are these military records that she is talking about that contradicts the yearbook and what was understood by everyone at that point? When someone makes a bold statement like this it should be backed up by something. You nor anyone else has asked them about this or other matters. Obviously you don't know about the interviews conducted in England on TV otherwise I would have to believe you would been asking this same question long ago.

I have a quite a bit of information on Melvin Brown and his military assignments and lots of other information from researching for many years now. It's becomes very apparent to me that the Browns don't seem to tell a straight story on anything. Outside of the Roswell tale itself nothing else lines up.




BrownPublicRecords said...

Granted there could be some legit patches of the Browns' testimony on some things about Roswell buried beneath their story but because there are so many things that are not accurate that at the end of the day, one must throw their testimony completely out the window. Just due to the fact that their playing the hide and seek game of Melvin's history putting him at places he couldn't possibly be and completely avoiding other places where he was stationed for a good many years. It gets to a point where it's impossible to sort out what is the truth and what is not and it's been that way all along. There's all of this clumsiness, avoidance of some things by practically putting a dark cloud over Melvin, completely wrong information of other things, and some sort of dishonesty hand waving going on while blaming it to the cover up. Where they say Melvin was not, is probably where he was. For that reason, I suspect that the bank account was a complete bogus story and if it could ever be proven that Melvin was back in United States at a later time, it would prove it. Whatever happened to Melvin, they sure don't want anyone to connect to his past. The only exception is the recent inquiry on Melvin's friend George D. Kelly on the Ckicksand's alumni (Bedford Borough Council) which some of Beverley's posts are now mysterious deleted from the website. My post on there trying to point out that Melvin & George were at Kirknewton, Scotland base at roughly the same time probably didn't help matters either since that post was now deleted also.

My guess is that something happen in the late 1950s involving Melvin when he was stationed at Kirknewton, Scotland. On his military records there is some bizarre resignation (Separation from Active Service) which is then quickly 'reenlisted' back in the service the very next day. The separation is labeled as COG (Convenience of Government) on his record which they put on almost anything where they have no other label for it. They use this code for such things as family matters for example. Furthermore the Browns never cover Scotland in any of their interviews whatsoever adds more suspicion to the mix. Especially when Harriet was born not too far away in Edinburgh, Scotland. This sure seems to point to something or for this special case, the Browns trying to point away from something.

There was always a Roswell cover up but there is also a Brown cover up going on as well and it's just as sneaky. Time is running out to find the truth on anything. This demands for someone that personally knew Melvin Brown from the late 1950s at the Kirknewton, Scotland Air Force Base to come forward and tell the researchers what they remember about him. Perhaps it may shed some light on some things. Just like the Roswell story itself, there are probably not many left that would remember him from the service days. In memory of Melvin, I suggest someone get on Coast To Coast and ask the public for help on anyone that was stationed at Kirknewton, Scotland in the late 1950s to come forward with what they remember and knew about Melvin. Did he share his stories with anyone there on that base? Is there some old photos of him from that time period?


Brown update said...

the reason for the 'bizarre resignation' and reenlistment was because he switched from Army service to Air force.

BrownPublicRecords said...

Hello 'Brown update';

That was a good guess and for some veteran's records it may very well apply but for Melvin's case, it's simply not the case nor is it very accurate.

You are off by about 13 years or so. It states in Melvin's military records several places in fact and very clearly that his transition from Army to Air Force occurred on the dates of Dec 2, 1945 and Dec 3, 1945 respectively.

The 'bizarre resignation' and reenlistment was in the late 1950s and is very clearly for something else. Very likely a family matter of some sort.


BrownPublicRecords said...

Looking back at things, it looks like Melvin's original discharge papers from the Army from Dec 2, 1945 show a Convenience Of Government reference so I can see why there may be some confusion. However, I was referring to a different document altogether and a different time stamp. I still have many FOIA requests being processed and others pending and may someday have an answer to all of this.

BrownPublicRecords said...

Melvin E. Brown was in the 6950th Squadron while at Chicksands, England. This squadron referred to as the Air Force Security Squadron during its conception and later becoming the 6950th Electronic Security Group. Melvin's group was often referred to as the RGM (Radio Group Mobile) at the time he was stationed there which sometimes is also coded as RADGRUMOB. He was also stationed at Kirknewton, Scotland under the 6952nd Squadron with a similar group function under abbreviation RSM. Both of these places he was going back and forth continuously along with many others. They were under USAFSS (United States Air Force Security Service) umbrella much like most of the personnel were.

It remains a mystery why it's completely unknown by researchers after all of these years that Melvin was ever at these bases. As there was always some wild speculation going on where Melvin was stationed in England along with if the 509th bomb group actually moved to England.

Someone may have known Melvin at these bases that is still with us today but never made the connection. Can we get anyone from either of these two bases from the late 1950s and early 60s to come forward with any memories of Melvin? Can we relay this question out to the media to pass around and maybe get someone's response here?

Are there any stories that travelled down the Marvin E. Brown family tree from the Los Angeles area? Marvin was Melvin's twin brother that was also a veteran. He passed away in the early 1990s. The 1940 census shows Marvin stationed at Fort Stevens Military Reservation, Clatsop, Oregon while Melvin was at Rural, Butte, California while starting their military careers.

I once had a brief correspondence with someone from Ronald Brown family side that remembers stories of their grandfather Marvin E. Brown and their grand uncle Melvin. Unfortunately, communications were cut short before I got to hear the stories. What were the stories told and shared among them?

BrownPublicRecords said...

I was able to get George Knapp's attention over here (At least to read this) but it was short lived. I guess when he has guests that are quite dominant in the area of Roswell they can quickly steer him away with their own agenda. I have to ask myself what is wrong with simply asking the public to ask around for anyone's memories of a particular person at a particular Air Force base? After all it does have to do with 'Roswell'. I think some people will be quite surprised if they ever make the connection.


BrownPublicRecords said...

Base on his records, Melvin E. Brown was mysteriously discharged from the HQ 6950th RAGGRUMO British Isles (USAFSS) on November 24, 1958. He was then just as mysteriously 're-enlisted' right back in the same place the very next day of November 25, 1958 as both of these entries indicate Chicksands, England Air Force base. Record entries following after this show 6952nd RSM which is Kirknewton, Scotland Air Force base. Perhaps it's nothing and maybe just a quick shucks I changed my mind over night type thing. After many attempts to determine the classification of this COG thru special FOIA requests with no luck, there was another redundant record of Melvin's which has some of the same dates and entries which was overlooked for some time. These records seem to be kept apparently from different sources back at that time as some are hand-written while others are typed and different format. Whatever the case this shows the discharge of Melvin on November 24, 1958 having some reference numbers as follows; SDN 903-COG AFR 39-14. The AFR 39-14 portion seems to be a standard procedure followed for honorable discharge and is believed to be a manual reference of some sort. With some internet searches it was determined that SDN stands for Separation Discharge Number sometimes also referred to as SPN. Base on reading some people's inquiries on their own military records, the number itself seems to be quite an 'unknown' on many records like it's some type of hidden code number within the military. 903 in particular for Melvin's case cannot be found anywhere although some other numbers are known and are commonly used on others. Since the Brown family seems to steer things away from Melvin's history especially around this very same time frame. (No Chicksands nor Scotland ever mentioned - Just go back to the old interviews and see for yourself) , it's been difficult to determine what this discharge reference was all about if anything. Can anyone out there with better sources determine what SDN-903 may represent? I have much more information and possibly a lead on someone with the name O'neal (O'neial) from that time frame. These one sided conversations only go a certain distance!