Now
that we have a final answer to the body shown in the Not Roswell Slides, it is
time to end the madness. There isn’t much more to be said. After two or three
years of this nonsense that involved nondisclosure agreements, secrecy and a
trickling of information into the public arena, the situation was put to rest
in just a few hours. Once good quality scans, with a proper, established
provenance were available, the placard was read with little difficulty and the
location of the mummy identified. I will note that Mesa Verde is not all that
far from the New Mexico border or all that far from Midland, Texas, since that
had always been an issue for some bizarre reason.
 |
| Tom Carey and Don Schmitt in happier times. Photo courtesy of Alejandro Rojas. |
When
I first learned of the existence of the slides, not from my "pals" Tom Carey and
Don Schmitt, but from a posting to Rich Reynolds UFO Conjectures, I was
somewhat dubious but also interested. But I understood their desire for secrecy
and there was that pesky NDA. Had no information leaked, they could have
carried out their research in private… but what would the outcome have been?
They didn’t take advantage of their opportunity and all their research looks to
be a little silly given the final outcome of this episode and how quickly that
happened.
Had
they not been so secretive, had Adam Dew not been there pulling strings, had
Tom and Don demanded to see the actual slides and get high resolution scans of
those slides, they would have learned within hours that the body was a mummy,
the placard said it was a mummy, and they could have been home on May 5th
enjoying the weather rather than flying off to Mexico City where they
proclaimed they had pictures of an alien creature.
Months
ago, before I had seen the screen grab, I asked Tom if it was possible this was
a mummy. He told me, “No,” and that they had looked at hundreds of pictures of
mummies and found nothing that matched… but I think he was looking for an exact
match as opposed to a general agreement with the features. Anyone who saw the
picture knew almost immediately is was a human and not an alien.
Anyway,
the point here, quickly, is had the data been shared earlier, the answer would
have been found earlier and the huge embarrassment of Mexico City could have
been avoided. I don’t know how they could have been so completely duped without
some sort of cooperation on their part. Had the data been shared, the resources
of the Internet could have been brought to bear and this episode would have
died quietly, never even becoming a footnote in the Roswell case.
I
suppose the second great reveal, scheduled for the International UFO Museum and
Research Center in Roswell this July will be cancelled. There is now nothing to
report other than there are no Roswell Slides .
If
I receive any communications from either Don or Tom who wish to express any thoughts
on this, I will publish them without editorial comment from me. If there is
nothing forthcoming from them, this will be the last of my Not Roswell Slides
postings.
71 comments:
Time to focus on other evidence for UFO Crashs. Not the Crash in Roswell but the Crash in the Plains of San Agustin. Here are some exciting Information about the crashed Spaceship at San Agustin:
http://www.ufocrashbook.com/index.html
The whole thing is a soap-opera, and it's good it got cancelled by the network. May it never be brought back with a new cast!
I was about to just nod in agreement and sign off when Michael Mu's comment did some very unpleasant things to my blood pressure.
The unfortunate reality is that the 'slides' saga is just one of a very long sequence of farcical episodes in ufology from the contactees, through MJ12 to the alien autopsy. So many cases have been loudly proclaimed with little or no evidence to support them that it is no wonder so many people ridicule anyone associated with this field.
San Augustin never had sufficient evidence to take it seriously. Aztec is another example that seems totally rediculous. Unfortunately there are quite a few very high profile cases that smell very fishy to me for reasons beyond the scope of this comment but are taken very seriously indeed.
I do not see any prospect of this pathetic cycle ending. The open access nature of the subject and it seems the fact that so many people seemed conditioned to the acceptance of the incredible ( to lift a 60+ year old observation from a CIA report) means this will go on. Mainstream ufology is a branch of the entertainment industry with a continual drive to the next big claim and ever more absurd allegations.
Perhaps individuals or small groups can chip away at the problem. It would be nice to think that this could be done on a 'cross party' basis with more objective members of the broadly sceptical and pro-ETH communities working together on specific topics where skills may be relevant. The rather vitriolic nature of most discussions however doesn't fill me with optimism, but as Lennon put it...'imagine...'
@Anthony Mugan
"San Augustin never had sufficient evidence to take it seriously."
Oh really? And how did then explain that there was found wreckage and the investigation has revealed that it was not from Earth???
Who is right - your opinion with increased blood pressure or scientific Results???
Just think about it...or not...and go the Doc with your blood pressure! :D
@Kevin
On the basis of extensive photo-analysis, I see what appears to be a cigar box full on cash in front of Schmitt.
.
A picture is indeed worth a thousand words.
.
...
The next mystery we now need to focus on is that on Don Schmitt's amazing skin tone - however he is achieving it I NEED TO KNOW because quite frankly it's damn impressive, and I want to achieve similar results.
Please Don, come forward now and reveal your secrets. I could care less about this whole alien thing - just let me know how you got that beautiful bronze glow, because I want it now!! I am seething with jealousy right now, simply simmering.
Kevin,
The question is where to go from here. If you take suggestions from the peanut gallery I'll offer this article by George Wingfield posted on Curt Collins' blog.
http://www.blueblurrylines.com/2015/04/cash-landrum-ufo-fresh-look-by-george.html
I would be interested to know what you think.
@TheDimov - can't say for sure, but maybe Don got that glow from spending someone elses' hard earned cash on his sunny vacations and plastic surgeons.
@Mu - Please provide your concrete evidence...even hardcore ET'ers don't buy that crash as anything real.
@Kevin - post a new thread on some of the more plausible crashes you often comment on or reference. There's more interesting stuff there.
@Tom and Don - Heard you speak on the radio about two years ago where you were asked if any Roswell crash debris would ever surface as proof positive....are you planning something similar with "I-beams" and hyroglyphics anytime soon? Seems that you said "it was forthcoming" and "you have located a potential source".
Kevin:
The other day, I stated on Rich's blogsite that I thought I knew where the mummy in question may have ended up. My guess was the Anasazi Heritage Center In Dolores, Colorado which, as it turned out, I visited a couple of weeks ago.
This morning I talked to the supervisory curator at that location and obtained a lot of useful information on the topic. Briefly, my initial guess was wrong. Human remains that were excavated from Mesa Verde were originally taken to two locations, the curation center located at the visitor center in the Park itself and the Colorado Historical Society (since renamed "History Colorado") headquarters in Denver.
As it turns out, the curator I talked to had been the chief curator at the Historical Society and personally had viewed every set of human remains that they owned.
She does not remember the specific 2 year old mummy recovered by Palmer, but says that mummified infants and children were not uncommon in the Mesa Verde pueblos, and they were usually interred with their finest garments and possessions. The mummification of these corpses was natural, due to the dry, hot, high altitude of Mesa Verde.
When the mummies first went on display in Denver (late 1800s) it was apparently very popular, with people lined up around the block. But by the mid 1900s, the displays were considered kind of ghoulish and started lagging in popularity. Nevertheless, my current best guess for the setting of the photograph would be Denver.
In 1990, Congress passed the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act, and all the human remains held by the Historical Society and the National Park were given back to Native Americans for re-interment.
So the particular mummy in question is probably back in the ground, now.
However, there were interment records and if anyone really cared to do so, they could possibly go examine those records at either Denver or Mesa Verde and figure out where the Palmer mummy finally ended up.
RIP
I think this should definitely not be the last thread on this topic. Adam Dew may be underground now along with his slide team, but something will resurface at some point. Last I saw at Slidebox Media Dew was saying it's a fake result on the placard. What an A-hole.
I definitely think follow-up topics need to be made until everything can come-out over years if necessary. This will NEVER be forgotten, and it IS BS to say this is a footnote to Roswell. This will be bigger than the Alien Autopsy, ultimately, imo, because of the extreme greed and pure lies to pull this off and the internet capture of the "earthly alien" mummy.
IF these jokers had not promoted this for three years, then some reasonable explanations WITH public apologies MIGHT be accepted. These "idiots" and/or thieves need to always be on the online and media firing squad till their dying day regarding aliens, ET, UFO's, Roswell, ETC.
UNLESS their previous research and books are independently verified by non-hoaxing researchers that is truly documented and verifiable, then everything they did is BS. Don't believe ANY of it, IMO.
Just one thought about how Adam Dew still claims the placard is in "cursive" script, and how in reality he has barely looked at the thing : what does he think it is, the Voynich manuscript, with practically every word ending in the same letter? One look at the placard and you can see the "cursive" is a result of camera blur. Spend a few seconds more and you can see capital letters superimposed about the actual supposed cursive letters.
The more I consider this whole sad affair the more the utter stupidity blows my mind, I mean it's just unbelievable to me what has transpired.
Mu:
re San Augustin:
"Oh really? And how did then explain that there was found wreckage and the investigation has revealed that it was not from Earth???"
The only stuff ever found on this planet that is not from Earth is meteorites. At least that is what science accepts as evidence (but it took many years before it was finally accepted as such).
Please either present the wreckage supposedly found on the Plains of San Augustin so that scientists can examine it, or point us to where it is held, again so that people can see and examine it.
Please, please DO NOT either tell us where the photos (slides maybe?) exist, or try to convene a conference where these photos are made public.
We want the REAL THING this time. Where is it? Even Stan Friedman can't answer that. Can you?
P.S.
I see where Frank Warren is now claiming to know that the photos were taken at the Montezuma Castle National Park. I don't know what information that is based on, but it does not conflict with anything the curator at the Anasazi Heritage Center told me.
If Frank's claim is true (and I have no reason to doubt it), that would probably mean that ownership of the mummies was retained by the National Park Service. That could explain why the curator who had been at the Colorado Historical Society had no memory of the Palmer mummy.
In any case, the disposition would have been the same--it would have been returned to native Americans for burial after about 1990 at the latest.
The only thing left in this sorry episode is for those involved to issue a mea culpa and call for the promoters of the event to issue a full refund. If a statement is not forthcoming which includes a call for a refund then I think that speaks to the character and trustworthiness of all the individuals involved.
Frankly, I don't think even an apology would help their credibility now. Their career as being considered serious researchers in this field is over. However, as decent human beings, they must return any money made as a result of this deception. Regardless of what they do now, at some point they are going to have to answer some rather embarrassing questions.
Hi Kevin,
Would you be interested in contributing to our seeking truth blog? Send me an email if you'd like more details - editorial @ gaiam dot com
Thanks!
Alex
I agree with you Dennis. The only possible way to show integrity and that indeed they were simply completely wrong with their judgment and that they indeed didn't do it for the money is to offer, and issue refunds. Jaime Massau may fare worst as he is already *ahem* $100K down from the gig, but if he has 100 thousand to throw around so easily surely 100K more wont do him any harm!
@Brian Bell and @cda
You can read it here...in the chapters:
http://www.ufocrashbook.com/index.html
I cant say more to that...i dont have the Book. I waiting for a german release! :-)
Why you dont mail to Art Campbell and ask him?
Write to their publisher - New Page Publshing.
Tell them the UFO community is going to collectively boycot their next new book based on fraudulent behaviors to stop sales and revenue. Then boycot their books.
Publishing houses can't afford to lose money or public face...if they back con artists they have a lot to lose.
Once they drop them, no major publishing house will take them - only small ones who don't care.
http://www.newpagebooks.com/?section=home&title=&author_id=Schmitt&isbn=&genre_id=&search=Go
Dr. Randle -- Thank you for ending discussion of this lamentable topic.
I may be in the minority (especially on this blog) but I feel sad for all the researchers who were involved in this fiasco.
Fortunately you weren't! And you have survived Frank Kauffmann. And Stanton Friedman has survived Gerald Anderson. And so hopefully Messrs. Carey & Schmitt (and Dolan and Braglia to the extent this blemishes them) will survive this and move on to better days.
Brian Bell said:
Tell them the UFO community is going to collectively boycot their next new book based on fraudulent behaviors to stop sales and revenue. Then boycot their books.
Shut up Brian, please. One of the worst parts of this bad story is that you have arrived to Kevin's blog, probably for ever (!)
Nick Redfern said...
'The whole thing is a soap-opera, and it's good it got cancelled by the network. May it never be brought back with a new cast!'
This is like when you're in a car, as a passenger, and the driver complains about how bad the traffic is.
Face it, all the people who ever posted anything on-line about the slides pre-May 5th, contributed to the controversy and publicity.
The controversy generated interest and ultimately, to some degree or other, to making money for the 'promoters'.
Now, some of the people who helped with the on-line publicity in this way are acting like they didn't.. and attacking only a few people who promoted the slides!
And...completely failing to criticise others who assisted with the research/promotion of the slides pre-May 5th and on the night.
LOlololololol yes Don you are so right about brian, a mind that is so tight you couldn't open it with a crow-bar. I think he should be nominated president of Good Ole Kimball's group.(AKA The Medieval times posters)
Hoping K.randle will open a discussion on "The Phoenix Lights of 1997", the first event 830pm)
@Don Maor and Jim Bender -
Love you too guys. Enjoy those hi-definition super glossy pics of that dead Roswell alien you're waiting to arrive.
Sometimes the truth stings a bit....doesn't it?
Jim -
Paul Kimball's group solved the mystery of the placard in a matter of hours while others worked years to do it. Say what you will, but he was right about the slides.
"Shut up Brian, please. One of the worst parts of this bad story is that you have arrived to Kevin's blog, probably for ever (!)"
Yes Don - I'm actually not sure what is more disappointing - the newbie on the blog or the whole slides fiasco...
Hi
It was an obvious fraud once Jamie M. got involved. Even hard core believers like myself realized very quickly it was a scam. But Like our court system I wanted the evidence to be presented.(innocent until proven guilty)
As far as Kimball's group, they are absolutely terrified of future disclosure from either the Government or the new James Webb telescope going live in 2018.
In fact Kimball won't even let you post on his website, you have to be part of the clan.
It never made sense an alien from Roswell, a supposed crash site rife with government cover-up, would be on display in an obvious museum setting.
And while the two slides being stashed away separately from the others might have originally created a sense of intrigue that they were super secret evidence of some kind, my original thought was that they were hidden away from all the other slides of the "pretty people" out of shame; since they clearly showed a poor mummified child.
But now after this past weekend's news, I have to doubt any story related to the discovery at all. At best this had seemed to me to be a case of willing misidentification, but the odor of deception is much stronger now.
Jim -
You've taken this about as far as I care to go and I don't know why you say I can't post to Kimball's blog. Do you read minds?
I will say that I attempted to remain neutral because there were promises of scientific research, evidence that the film was manufactured in 1947 and an assurance from Tom and Tony that the body in the slide was not human but alien. I posted a number of times that I hoped we'd get solid evidence but when the time arrived, it was the same sort of damaged goods we get all the time.
In fact, I mentioned that in 1997, there were those who claimed they had a piece of metal with a known provenance and a solid chain of custody that would be released at a press conference. There was discussion of a scientist who would be there to talk of isotopic ratios and evidence that the metal had not been manufactured on Earth... but when the time came, there was no revelation about the soldier who picked up the metal, there was no provenance offered, there was no chain of custody... and there was a single scientist who ran out the back door after giving his lecture. When I talked to him a couple of days later, I learned that all was not as clear cut as he said and there were no other scientists on board.
The point? I waited, hoping that this would not turn into the fiasco that it was... and then, within hours, the placard was read by two or three independent research teams and the mummy was located.
This whole thing is a very sad affair and it just might have killed the Roswell case in a way that the Air Force could not do in 1994. The only culprits in this are the people who were on the stage and who did not perform their due diligence. How do I know? Because it was a freaking mummy.
Hi
Kevin, do you believe Roswell event of 1947 was non-ufo event? A weather balloon with crash dummies?
It's ok, every individual is entitled to their own opinion, but the weather balloon/crash dummies explanation doesn't work for me
A Dipole Moment is a quantity that describes two opposite charges separated by a distance. It is a quantity that we can measure for a molecule in the lab and thereby determine the size of the partial charges on the molecule.
If a molecule has a Dipole Moment, then we call it "polar."
I posit that the Roswell Slides are Ufology's "Dipole Moment".
One charge consisted of hoaxers & dupes.
The other charge consisted of people like the RSRG & Kevin.
The distance which separated them was the mass populace.
Dew,et.al. have polarized the general public even further from any serious discussion of ufology and ufological research.
I believe this to be a watershed moment in ufology.
Nonetheless, something good, something quite efficacious may very well come out of this debacle.
I prefer to look at this "Dipole Moment" as an opportunity to reverse the polarity in ufology. An opportunity, if you will, to seize the asylum back from the inmates.
In the end, it is rather Darwinistic. Chaff separating from the wheat. Survival of the fittest, or, in this case, Survival of Integrity.
I totally respect and agree with Kevin's words here.
He has always behaved in an honorable and decent manner.
I daresay he was hoping to facilitate some new evidence, sadly only to be done in by the current culprits Carey, Dew and Schmitt.
Anyone is free to leave a reasoned comment at either my personal blog or at the Roswell Slides Research Group.
As for Kevin, I will say here (as I have at blog) - for what it's worth - that I was far too hard on him a couple of years ago. There were villains, liars and fools in this affair, but he wasn't one of them.
PK
@Jim Bender
It was not a weather ballon...it was only SWAMPGAS! Everybody know that! ^^ ;-)
Paul,
I am glad to see those above comments. I hope you guys can be friends again.
Lance
I hate to admit that I threw away 20 dollars. Can't any news reporter (Adam Dew) be trusted anymore?
lololol
Paul, your bias posts and website regarding your bizarre views are no different(regarding your extreme views and with horrible evidence) than the Not Roswell slides fiasco groups bias and methods.
My friends and I have tried to post multiple times on your extremely biased website. Its called NO ADMITTANCE, not that we care about you and your group's medieval views!!!
Jim Bender:
What do you think will be disclosed either by the government or by the James Webb space telescope in 2018? You claim PK and others will be "absolutely terrified" by this forthcoming disclosure.
Nobody was "terrified" by any of the Hubble disclosures, were they? And nobody is, or will be, terrified of anything else regarding discoveries in space either.
Unless you have good reason to believe otherwise. Have you? An asteroid approaching the earth, maybe?
@Rob,
"...Can't any news reporter (Adam Dew) be trusted anymore...". Experience is a dear teacher, but now you know:)
.
'News reporters', no. Blow-dried meat puppets. There are few real investigative journalists around today.
.
I'm hoping Robert Hastings has some luck selling his new documentary to a network. That one will be worth watching, and it won't cost you $20.
.
...
@Jim Bender -
Got to agree with the others that your claim of certain people (Paul being one) becoming "terrified" of disclosure is ridiculous.
You've clearly bought into the 1960 "Brookings Report" which did not claim society would collapse or even world religions, but that social impacts resulting from discovery (not disclosure) should continue to be studied. Nothing would collapse - and since you claim "they are here" already - what has collapsed so far with or without government secrecy? Nothing.
Religious leaders are not "afraid" of any type ET disclosure. Show us the evidence where you have world religious leaders stating publically their "fear" about ET. It's not there.
Fact is the average "man on the street" could care less about any "disclosure" because he already believes it might be possible, at least at the microbial level if not more.
"Disclosure" would be a non-event for most people who are far more concerned about paying bills, getting food on their tables, advancing their careers, raising families, and having relationships and freedom to do as they like.
No one is afraid of disclosure - that's an ET'ers "I want it to happen that way" pipe dream. And that makes Dolan's book "After Disclosure" an excercise in nothing but pure speculation.
@Mu -
Your support of the "crash on the Plains of San Augustin" is a bit much. The link you provide to your evidence is even less compelling:
http://ufocrashbook.com/index.html
Website depicts a treasure hunter with metal detector who scours the desert looking for odd debris or historical artifacts.
The odd stuff he shows on his website is called "aluminum" and it's used in all sorts of farm and ranch equipment - including those located in the desert. That's not "alien stuff"....it's human stuff.
Check out the child's shoe he claims was flung from an alien crash pilot.....really?
All -
Discussion of the nonsensical Plains of San Agustin crash ends here. It is a topic for later.
No skeptic that I know of is afraid of the prospect of contact with a non-human or extraterrestrial intelligence. Indeed, we think it would be really cool. We just don't see any evidence to support the claim that it has already happened... but we keep an open mind.
No, what we're really afraid of is the prospect of people like Jim dragging us back into the dark ages with their anti-science "will to believe."
PK
P.S And Jim's claim that I haven't published his comments is false. I've never even heard of him before now.
check out Kimball's blog is it anything like K.randle???? How many posts??? lol
KRandle's blog "A different Perspective" is a model of free speech!!!!!!!! Your clan should embrace this fact
Kimball you should own up to the fact that you run a Putin style blog, similar to "The Russian Times"!!!!!!!!!
We should call you Pinocchio now, a bunch of us have tried multiple times to post over the last months.
Brian,
You obviously haven't kept up the polls the last 10 years regarding the world population view of "Are we alone?", you are way way outnumbered. Get a grip" WE ARE NOT ALONE". also they know estimate that there are over 20 billion earths in our Milky Way.
Sorry you lose!!!!!!!!
http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/11/04/243062655/scientists-estimate-20-billion-earth-like-planets-in-our-galaxy
Where is Adam Dew in all of this now? Has he said anything after the press conference? ...Even the bigfoot guys apologized!
KR - "This whole thing is a very sad affair and it just might have killed the Roswell case in a way that the Air Force could not do in 1994..."
Hang on,hang on, hang on!
In the grand scheme of things, nothing has really changed.
Both sides of the debate are still in a kind of stalemate. The sceptical side of the argument is still at a loss to explain the incredible actions of the military in June 47 and the desperate scramble to blame a balloon (be it weather or mogul)ever since, when it's obvious, even to an idiot,that something as simple as that could not possibly have caused such a stir.
And the people arguing for the ET explaination (yep...I'm still one of them) are still reduced to holding their heads in their hands when confronted with the question of how the "clean-up" was so ruthlessly successful...ie, not one piece of the reported thousands of pieces of wreckage wasn't somehow smuggled out of the place to be shown off a few decades later by some dying military man who no longer had to worry about his pension or a courts martial.
Nothing has really changed besides Don Schmitt's reputation, as an investigator, going from "damaged" to "holed beneath the water-line"...and now to be joined by Tom Carey and Tony Bragalia. (Sorry Tony, but you saw those slides and you MUST HAVE KNOWN that was never going to be anything but a mummy or dummy in some kind of exhibit. When the guys on the German website supplied us with their screen-grab, my hopes for this actually being an alien sank within 6o seconds....so you MUST HAVE smelt a rat too.
We're exactly where we were three years ago chaps!
@Brian Bell
Why you not follow the advice that Don Maor gave to you:
"Shut up!"
Get a grip" WE ARE NOT ALONE". also they know estimate that there are over 20 billion earths in our Milky Way.
You meant civilizations with the UFO-myth at play, crashologists, like us too? But without scientific evidence to be or have been visited by us/them?
Yes, there is a possibility ^^
Regards,
Gilles
@Mu and Don -
It's not that I can't "shut up"....it's that I can't stop myself from laughing! Mu - will you be displaying any "tiny alien shoes" in Mexico City anytime soon? Got some contacts you might want to connect with....Maussan for one. :)
All -
The personal comments stop now. I don't understand why you all cannot stay on topic.
Hi
Yes the NOT ROSWELL SLIDE group should reimburse everybody,and they should exit the study of UFO's.Similar to attending a horrible movie at $15 a pop.
Lets move on, what about one of the following events?
1) "lights over Phoenix 1997" first event 8:30pm.
2)John Podesta's recent comments regarding UFO's
3) Kevin, do you have any insight to:
Joseph Montoya,the Roswell Alien Bodies and Ruben and Pete Anaya. did you interview the two brothers?
@Jim Bender
Good Idea with Phoenix Lights 1997. I know that Dr. Steven M. Greer and his Team made Contact with ETs and they came to Phoenix 1997. Thats really amazing!
Do you that meanwhile exist a "Underground" Contact Scene all over the World, in all many Countrys and they make Contact with peacefull ETs from annother Starsystems with the from Dr. Steven M. Greer developed CE 5 Protocolls?
Believe it or not...but at Facebook i spoke with many Contactees, i know many Contactees who use the Ce 5 Protocolls and it works really!
That is the Truth and the Reality!!!
@Mu - I think Kevin already said you're supposed to stay on topic.
@Jim Bender - Have to wait for Kevin to post another thread as this one is not about the Phoenix Lights.
Back on Mexico City - does anyone suspect Schmitt and Carey to comment ever on this?
They can't be silent forever with a new book release.
Michael Mu
Sorry, I am not a big believer in Dr. Steven M. Greer. Were you serious or joking?
Brian
Last time I checked this wasn't your blog
Part 1 of 2:
"Now that we have a final answer to the body shown in the Not Roswell Slides, it is time to end the madness. There isn’t much more to be said."
Well, I really wouldn't blame you, Kevin, if this does turn out to be the last post you do on the "Roswell slides," considering how crazy this all finally became, and with the denouement of "Placardgate," but I hope it isn't the last because in fact there are other critical issues that are still important to try and resolve, if possible, that relate to personal accountability and culpability.
And, there are further lessons to be learned which can only be found out by additional investigation.
In Tony's "apologia," he seems to point the finger at Adam Dew and implies Dew provided altered, lower-resolution versions of the slides, and the placard, to Tom and Don, and thus presumably in turn to himself.
I have no idea what versions may have been provided to either Don, Tom, or Tony, but I find it very difficult to believe that all three of them would have spent the amount of time and energy over the past two+ years investigating and promoting the slides (particularly Tony, since Don and Tom have been and are still relatively silent on these matters other than Tom's premature and erroneous "smoking gun" claim about the slides several months ago, and a few other statements Don and Tom made in the run-up to the May 5th "reveal") if any of them knew what the deciphered placard actually said before the RSRG revelation of the placard's text. That, however, is one of the points to be hopefully clarified at some point. It is crucial, in fact.
Don and Tom also need to make some kind of public statement similar to Tony's, IMHO, at the very least. And soon, along with more detail about the nature of their contacts with Dew.
[Update: Don and Tom have now provided Kevin and Curt Collins with a statement, but it is no apology or "mea culpa" -- it is simply a further attempt at denial of the now obvious, which is deeply disappointing. The statement also tries to throw Tony overboard their sinking ship, wherein the statement says, in part: "A copy [of the placard image] also was also sent to aggressive Roswell researcher Anthony Bragalia who also reported to me that it was "unreadable." (Bragalia has now aggressively joined in with our critics)."
[This is ludicrous, since it was Tony who in his "apologia" provided essential supplementary data about the origin of the mummy, who found it, and who donated it for display, the basis for the placard text, and which absolutely confirms the text of the deciphered placard as being what the RSRG says it is. See Tony's reference to the September 1938 Volume VIII, Number 1 Mesa Verde Notes in an article entitled "Around the Mesa," paragraph four:
[“A splendid mummy was received by the Park Museum recently when Mr. S.L. Palmer Jr. of San Francisco returned one that his father had taken from the ruins in 1894. The mummy is that of a two year old boy and is in an excellent state of preservation. At the time of burial the body was clad in a slip-over cotton shirt and three small cotton blankets. Fragments of these are still on the mummy.” The full text of the article can be found in this link:
http://npshistory.com/nature_notes/meve/vol8-1f.htm
["This paragraph corresponds directly to the slides placard..."]
@Jim Bender
The CE 5 Protocolls works...you ask the People in the Facebook Group "The CE 5 Initiative"...there are many People who can tell you that its works.
I am also did the CE 5 Protocolls and i had some strange Experiences:
- strange UFO Dreams i had not before
- once i had a strange Vision during the Meditation and saw the Face of ET Woman(?) with strange Eyes...i saw also such Beings in my Dreams before.
But such UFO Dreams or Visions are no Endividence!
Sometimes when i am try to Contact ETs i looked the Das after in UFO Sightings Reports nearby my Hometown and often i read some Reports that could be happened because i contact them and asked them if they can showto other People.
Once i try to contact the ETs or UFOs that Kenneth Arnold saw in the year 1947 and asked them if they can show nearby my Hometown.
As i read the UFO Reports some Day later one UFO-Witness reportet a UFO Sighting some hours later on the same Day as if did my Meditation and asked the ETs.
The UFO Witness described the UFO as coat hanger, as some kind of sickle-shapedand so. The same shaped like Kenneth Arnold described his UFOs.
Thats no joke...it really happened!
Ok,
Do a google search for the following article from the Wall Street Journal "Science, Spirituality, and some mismatched socks"
by Gautam Naik
It was several years ago
It blew my mind
Part 2 of 2:
If it turns out to be true that Dew supplied versions of the slides that were anything less than the highest-resolution copies made, or that the placard was in any way obscured or altered before being supplied to the remaining "Dream Team," who were brought in as consultants under non-disclosure to help analyse them, then Dew is to blame for misleading them, and you have to ask why that might be.
If true, the answer seems obvious: it suggests an intentional cover-up. Maybe...
Could Dew or his own technical helpers (not the DT) have never been able to themselves resolve clearly enough what the placard essentially says, "MUMMIFIED BODY OF TWO YEAR OLD BOY" in the over two year period they were being investigated? I suppose that's possible too, but I find that unlikely, since they had the original slides and the very best, blown-up and enhanced copies available.
Interestingly, Dew still (as of May 12th) has his May 9th "response" online at slideboxmedia.com/placard/ where he says (excerpted):
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The "Roswell Slides Research Group" fake placard
This is the photoshoped [sic] original that the group
is claiming they worked from BEFORE the claimed debluring [sic]
"The “Roswell Research Group” claim to have de-blured [sic] the placard but we have our doubts because we have been unable to replicate their results using the same software. We are in contact with the software company and are requesting their analysis of the authenticity of the groups [sic] results.
"We suspect that they created their own modified version."
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[Update: this comment was drafted early this morning -- it now appears that later in the day Dew deleted the other placard photos and text as quoted here, above. I think that deletion reveals Dew's "CYA" intent.]
Let's put it this way:
It's one thing to sincerely believe, possibly due to pareidolia combined with a deep confirmation bias and inadequate investigation, what the slides were thought to show, which I think the "Dream Team" has to take full responsibility for, and assuming they did not know what the placard actually said, but it's wholly another matter for anyone to, if they knew what the placard said, go ahead and promote an obvious fraud based on hoax and manipulation of others to promote their own personal and pecuniary interests at the expense of and consequences to others.
I think more needs to be found out about the owners and controllers of the slides, like Dew, and that further investigation of the issues cited here needs to be continued.
If Dew refuses to cooperate, or put on his site what we all know now to be true, then he's guilty of a deliberate cover-up and possible fraud for promoting this lame hoax. Which would also be even more ineffably stupid than what has preceded it. This is all about "who knew what and when and how." If the "crime" is compounded by "cover-up," things will become even worse for those who may have perpetrated it. Nixon found that out, belatedly.
Let the chips fall where they may. But this ain't over yet, not by a long shot. Nor, for those urging others to "move on," should it be.
We need to get to the very bottom of all these important remaining, unresolved questions in order for some of the deeper lessons that should be learned behind this affair can be exposed and made available to those willing and able to learn from them.
@Michael Mu & Jim Bender:
You two guys must be truly oblivious to yourselves and the context of this comment thread.
Please restrain yourselves.
Ok Steve uncle uncle lol
I have moved regarding this topic, burn out!! but skeptics want to keep it going forever.
The statement also tries to throw Tony overboard their sinking ship, wherein the statement says, in part: "A copy [of the placard image] also was also sent to aggressive Roswell researcher Anthony Bragalia who also reported to me that it was "unreadable." (Bragalia has now aggressively joined in with our critics)."
Seems only fair after Bragalia threw Dew under the bus.
Who knows what really happened between Dew, Carey, Schmitt, Bragalia, Maussan? From the sounds of it, even they don't know. The one thing that should be obvious is that they are all complicit in the Slides Sham. Hopefully nobody ever takes any of them seriously again.
That would be fitting end for all of them.
b"h
Could anyone briefly tell me what Bragalia's "real world" career is / was?
The general backgrounds are known of Dew, Carey, Schmitt and Maussan (and Dolan, Edgar Mitchell, and the experts at the 5-5-15 reveal). I just have not found anything about AJB's areas of expertise. Thanks.
Steve said above:
"It's one thing to sincerely believe, possibly due to pareidolia combined with a deep confirmation bias and inadequate investigation, what the slides were thought to show. . ."
IMHO a heavy dose of the Dunning-Kruger effect must be added.
b"h
Thanks Steve. Yes, I googled AJB, but not for several minutes. It's not that critical for me.
Just to clarify regarding my opinion that some measure of the D-K effect likely applies:
If the slides were known to be blurry (the placard) then one would have to be extremely wary of drawing specific technical conclusions about any other part of the image (the anatomical nature of the body). If this simple fact was under-appreciated for evidence that was publically called a "smoking gun" then, imho, the D-K effect applies, but not necessarily to anyone in particular.
Yet AJB's conduct, his forceful, even scathing assertions that the being was not a human, or a mummy, could lead one to believe he thought he was competent to pronounce such a verdict, while actually he was not. But please, I do not suggest that AJB is anymore flawed a human than any of us. Best.
Tony has said that he never attends UFO conferences and never gives interviews to the media about UFOs.
Presumably this is because he fears his employment might be compromised in some way. If he is indeed a CEO of his own company this seems most unlikely. In fact he may well find that a lot of the heads he 'hunts', as well as the 'hunters' themselves, are just as UFO-oriented as he is.
But this is decidedly off-topic, eh Kevin?
I'll keep an eye out for the documentary
I have met Dolan and Schmitt, and think both to be knowledgeable in the field. For that reason I was anxious for May 5th. Going in, I expected it to be a mummy or something along that line, but not denied, only to be so obvious. I have learned a lot.
I was warned a few months back. I was speaking with Ray Stanford, I asked him what he thought about the slides. He told me not to buy any of it.
@CDA -
Yes....one has to wonder why Tony and other UFOlogists, including their followers some of whom are on this blog, are so adamant about their ET convictions but hide behind fictitious names while all the time criticizing "skeptics". Seems to me folks if you really are that convinced you should come out of the closet rather than remain anonymous.
Nitram you are a prime example.
@ Scott Lee
I agree with a lot of that Scott. Dolan saw fit to get mixed up with the “CIA deathbed confession” nonsense… now this. Just another brandname personality in the cult of Ufology that can be tuned out.
The problem is… the phenomena are still there, and stripped of complexity, the skeptic position rests on one narrow assumption. It’s because of that assumption our debates aren’t “what do they want” or “why are they here” or even more intriguingly “how do they get here”… no… it’s because of that one narrow assumption we never have those debates. Every single debate devolves into name-calling, smears, ad hominem attacks and ridicule. Why? Because of that singular assumption.
We can’t go there.
That’s it. That is the entire enormity of the skeptic case in five words.
We can’t go there… so… they can’t be here. So… what you saw was a temperature inversion.. or swamp gas… Venus low on the horizon, flares… a mental delusion or a deliberately staged hoax by someone who craves fame, fortune and attention, because it is a well-known fact that staging UFO hoaxes is the path to the Fortune 500. Ask the gang that just spoofed us all with this Roswell slides bs, I’m sure they’re all at the Ferrari dealership right now picking out their new wheels.
We can’t figure out how to go there… so they can’t be here. Because surely if we can’t figure it out, no one else can. It’s funny how quick skeptics pull the anthropocentric bias card on little grey aliens, but the core assumption of skepticism is itself rooted in anthropocentric myopia.
Funnily enough, it is the evolution of scientific progress itself that almost dictates this silliness will eventually evaporate. 800 years ago the earth was flat, and the center of the known universe. Man was the sole intelligent life form in the universe. Two of those hallowed assumptions have been felled by science, and it is science itself that is slowly creeping to a grudging acknowledgement that the universe is likely teeming with life. Embracing scientific bias religiously, you can actually calculate almost to the decade the exact time modern science will embrace the existence of intelligent extraterrestrial life. That is… the day _we_ figure out how to go there and find it. Applause all around. We may not ultimately be the most intelligent lifeforms in the universe… but we’re the most intelligent lifeforms in the universe… in our own minds. Standing ovation for modern science.
Kevin, Larry,
My initial notation re "Montezuma Castle" was done in haste and I was melding "Camp Verde" in Arizona with Mesa Verde in Colorado; it has since been corrected to read:
Regarding the mummy: it was part of the S. L. Palmer collection, originally excavated by him in 1896 at Camp Verde / Montzuma Castle, Arizona. Palmer’s son in the late ‘30’s loaned the child mummy and other artifacts to the (then) Mesa Verde Museum in Colorado, this is where the infamous photographs/slides were taken although it is not known by whom.
Cheers,
Frank
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