Thursday, September 13, 2012

Project Aquarius, Steve Pierce and Other Questions

There have been a number of questions that have appeared in the comments sections of previous postings and I thought this might be a good place to deal with some of those, rather than searching from posting to posting.

First, let’s deal with this Project Aquarius nonsense. It was pointed out that Aquarius was a real classified project from the NSA. At least that was the original premise. However, Barry Greenwood, first in Just Cause and reprinted in the December 1987 (issue 236) of the MUFON UFO Journal, said, “Finally, our last issue [Just Cause] dealt with the sort-lived confirmation of an Air Force ‘Project Aquarius’ by the NSA. The revelation fizzled however when the NSA retracted its confirmation based on a false assumption… No other independent confirmation of the Project Aquarius document has been possible.”
Sure, the true believers are going to say, “And you believe this?” And my answer is going to be, do you have any independent confirmation of Project Aquarius?
I thought not.
More to the point, two of the projects listed in the Aquarius document have been identified. Project Snowbird, which had to do with flying alien craft, according to Aquarius, was actually a joint Army/Air Force cold weather training exercise. Code words are not duplicated because that could lead to the compromise of highly classified information. There is a two volume Code Name Directory to prevent that from happening.
Project Sigma, also in the Aquarius document which claimed it was an attempt to communicate with alien intelligence, was a classified project between the Air Force and Rockwell International.
If the information about these two projects, contained in the Aquarius document is inaccurate, what does that say about the rest of the document? Since there is no provenance for it and since it is filled with misinformation, is it no wonder that proponents of MJ-12 seem to have forgotten about it. Neither Stan Friedman nor Robert Wood has provided answers to my questions about these Aquarius documents.
Another area that has bothered the readers is my interview with Steve Pierce. Frankly I was surprised by some of the responses. I wasn’t advocating for the Walton abduction. I was not suggesting that it was based on alien intervention and anyone who has read my writings on alien abduction knows my point of view. No, I was suggesting that Pierce related what he had seen and done the night Walton disappeared, and his impressions of his interaction with Philip Klass.
What I wanted to know when I interviewed Pierce, was his view of the Klass story. We had heard from others, but not from Pierce himself. It seemed to me that he was more amused by Klass than intimidated or annoyed by him. While it is clear to me that he believed that Klass had offered money for his “confession,” I am not convinced that an actual offer of payment had been made by Klass. In other words, I think that Pierce believed that Klass had made an offer, though that offer was indirect. I think that it was mainly a misunderstanding and with that I think we could say that both sides are telling the truth… which is not to say that both sides are telling a truth grounded in our shared reality.
This means, simply, that Pierce believes an offer was made. Klass had said no such offer was made. Both believe, or believed, what he said. Both are right… I think that Pierce misunderstood what he was told by third parties… In other words, I have no reason to doubt what he said.

I also pointed out that Pierce thought that Klass was a fairly charming fellow, which, when you moved away from some of the outrageous things he said about UFO witnesses and researchers, was true. He could be vindictive and nasty in a UFO fight, but on other topics he was quite funny. He told me once that Aviation Week photographers had taken some good pictures of the latest Soviet fighters at the Paris Air Show in the 1980s. The magazine gave the originals to the Air Force, but somehow failed to get a print of one of the pictures. When they asked for it they were told they couldn’t have it because the pictures were classified… which makes no sense (meaning that the Air Force would classify them since the aircraft had been introduced in a public setting where everyone and his brother could take pictures so the source wouldn’t have been compromised… but I digress…)
So, I published an interview with Pierce providing his perspective on these events with Klass, and I have annoyed some… How could I trust Pierce? Well, I sat down with him, talked with him, and he didn’t say anything particularly controversial, other than Klass could be charming.
Finally, there is this latest allegation that I’m a shill for the military, though I’m not completely sure what this means. This isn’t the first time that something like this has happened. I was accused of working on Project Blue Book with Hector Quintanilla, I was a CIA agent of some kind, that I had been spying on APRO for the Air Force, and I don’t know what all. This latest seems to have been raised by Douglas Dietrich, who I don’t believe I have ever met and who I do not know. No evidence for this has been presented, but some believe it… It is not true and if Dietrich said anything like this, he is on thin ice.
This is one of those situations where the two of us know the truth. If he said it, he knows he’s making it up… I know what I have done in the military and what I haven’t done, and nothing in this allegation is true. If I find a source for the allegation, and Dietrich’s name is attached, I may go after him. And I assure those out there that there is nothing embarrassing in my military file or embarrassing questions to be asked that would prevent this.
Of all these above points, I think those about Project Aquarius are the most important. This is an issue that should have been resolved when more was learned about it, one of the Aquarius documents was proved to be a forgery, and when the information contained in it was found to be inaccurate. In today’s world, there are those who still believe in MJ-12 but ignore those documents that came before the “Big Three” that show just how flawed they are. They continue to pontificate about MJ-12, saying the criticisms have been answered, but, of course, they have not. MJ-12 should be dead but it is not. I don’t know what more we can do it kill it, other than continue to raise these points.



cda said...

You probably cannot kill MJ-12 for those determined to believe and accept it. Fortunately these people are few in number.

As to fake documents such as the Aquarius one, the matter was dealt briefly by the GAO in 1995. Remember that there are a number of documents (such as this) that were originally perfectly genuine. The date, authorship (if given), terminology and abbreviations used can all be genuine yet the document is phony. It is phony because some forger has 'doctored' the original and added things like "Snowbird" and "MJ TWELVE" or "MJ-12" to it or maybe altered the punctuation to give it a different meaning.

Therefore the document, when presented to the public, looks OK when it is not.

Some documents are entirely false of course, but it is a fair bet that others are adapted from original authentic ones. Robert Todd analysed one in particular, showing how false words and phrases had been substituted for the original genuine ones, and the security markings were changed.

starman said...

"Fortunately these people are few in number."

So you don't think Friedman has much of a following? People here may doubt what he wrote; dunno about the average reader of TOP SECRET/MAJIK.

Unknown said...

"I was accused of working on Project Blue Book with Hector Quintanilla, I was a CIA agent of some kind, that I had been spying on APRO for the Air Force, and I don’t know what all." I parse your words, I don't see a denial of spying, for money, on CUFOS in the 1970s for that APRO connected UFO magazine, right?

KRandle said...

Chuck -

You must be obtuse. I did not spy on CUFOS for APRO, I did not spy on APRO for the Air Force. I did not work for Blue Book in any capacity... I was either too young or serving with the Army. I did not work for the CIA. These charges and allegations are without merit, are untrue, and are lies. How's that? Specific enough for you?

And I certainly don't know what APRO connected magazine to which you refer, but just to make sure it is clear, I did not spy on CUFOS for that magazine.

Terry the Censor said...

In Captured!, a book about the Hill case, Friedman mentions...MJ-12! Really: Donald Menzel spoke against the Hill case, Menzel was in MJ-12, therefore, Menzel is a liar, therefore, the Hill case is proven!
What Friedman failed to mention was Menzel's praise of Marjorie Fish's work. Menzel was able to cast doubt on it only by going into a detailed statistical analysis -- that is, by taking it seriously as science.
Ironically, Friedman himself can no longer engage the Fish map seriously or scientifically. Recent star chart measurements have shown the stars are not where Fish thought they were, thus invalidating her identifications. Martin Shough put this matter directly to Friedman in 2008 and 2011 on UFO Updates -- the first time, Friedman did not answer, the second time, he claimed he was too busy to answer.
Friedman, undaunted, continues to tell scientists how to do their job, and of course continues to break all the rules of debunking he mentions in every other column he writes.

So, uh, that's the kind of people who still support MJ-12.

(I knew I'd remember the topic by the end of my comment.)

Anonymous said...

Just wondered how Dietrich, then very young when he supposedly destroyed 1000s of documents, had the time to actually read such detail and remember all the information?.
He must have some kind of super memory!!
Would he have actually been allowed to read them in the first place?...and if he did read them, he must have spent literally 100s of hours going through them..

If the material was of such importance.... why was he not searched after he destroyed them for notes?....and if he had no notes, then the feat6 of memory is truly out of this world!

Unknown said...

OK Why Would the NSA Say That the US Airforce Has A Project Aquarius in 1987 = They the NSA Knows About

Unknown said...

they Know About it.