I
have been asked to provide some commentary on the Chinese Spy Balloon. George
Noory mentioned just prior to my weekly segment on Coast-to-Coast AM,
and I called it the Chinese Project Mogul.
My
first thought was to accept the idea that this was an errant weather balloon
because there are more technologically advanced methods of spying such as
satellites and high-flying aircraft that skirt the edges of outer space. Why
send a balloon if you have that capability? Besides, aren’t balloons driven by
the winds. Then we learn that this balloon has some steering capabilities, so
the claim that it was blown off course seems to be something of a, well, lie.
Now
we learn that this isn’t the first time that this has happened but apparently
is the first time that the media, both professional and social, learned about
it. This time we all know about it. And we learn that there is another balloon
sailing above South America, which suggests that the Chinese are either inept
in their balloon technology or they are being less than candid about it.
Since
the balloon is over US airspace, I want to know the real reason that it hasn’t
been shot down. I want to know the real the reason that if they, meaning that
our military and our government leaders, believe there is a spy mission aspect
to it, why hasn’t it been destroyed. We’re told that there is a worry about
injuries to those on the ground. When was the last time that you heard that pieces
of a balloon, falling from the sky, had injured anyone? How many true weather
balloons are launched in this country daily and how many have dropped on people?
Without
filling this with a lot of comments from government officials and military
officers, I will note simply, that many seem to share my desire to see the
thing shot out of the sky. I would have initiated that the moment it crossed
into US airspace over Alaska. If it is an errant weather balloon, then no one
in China would care. If it was some sort of spy craft, then that evidence could
be presented to the UN with a warning that all other such objects will be shot
down.
And,
I have to wonder if some of the UAP sightings by our military on maneuvers
weren’t seeing these “weather” balloons. Maybe that is one of the reasons that
we have both a rather poorly written and less than informative unclassified
version of the UAP report while Congress gets a classified version. This could
be an issue of national security… but now all that is out in the open.
What
it boils down to is that a foreign power has deployed (either intentionally or
accidently) a device over the United States. It is allowed to drift (steer?)
over some of our military facilities without any real response by our
government. We won’t shoot it down because people on the ground might be
injured (I’m sorry, but seems like the dumbest excuse ever), and this isn’t the
first time that this has happened.
And
I wonder what the Chinese response would be in similar circumstances. Would
they dither around, worried about injuring people on the ground, or would they
take aggressive action against this violation of their airspace? And if we shot
the thing out of the sky, would we now have to admit that we’ve allowed them to
spy on us using balloons in the past?
The
important point here is that there is a Chinese balloon drifting over the United
States and we know it’s there. We believe it has a spy capability, but we take
no action against it. We worry about falling debris injuring people on the
ground, but you have to wonder about that… I mean, there are great parts of
this country where there are virtually no one to be injured. Why hasn’t action
been taken? So that this won’t blow up into an international incident? That
ship has already sailed, or should I say, that balloon has already been
launched.
And
not back to my regularly scheduled postings…
PS:
The AP story mentioned Roswell, Project Mogul, and the excuse that Mogul was to
detect Soviet missile launches. Other than the fact that Mogul was not responsible
for the debris located by Mack Brazel, that Mogul was designed to detect Soviet
experiments with atomic weapons, and that Flight No. 4 had been cancelled, that
little bit of information about Mogul seemed to be almost accurate and totally
irrelevant.
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24 comments:
https://www.reddit.com/r/WarplanePorn/comments/pgtbhw/wreckages_of_taiwanese_u2_planes_which_were_shot/
China shot down U2's over their country
Thanks for posting this. Given your extensive intelligence background in addition to your knowledge of military balloon use, I wanted to know what your opinion is about all this.
As of this writing, the balloon has been shot down over water. As you suggest, there seems to be a lot about this story that we are not being told. I have the same questions you have. Also, how many times has this happened over U.S. territory? Why are the Chinese using balloons when they have spy satellites that supposedly do the same thing? Wouldn't the Chinese know the balloon would be detected?
Was there any weaponry on board? One retired high-level Air Force official said on national news that such a balloon is capable of carrying EMP weaponry. He also said the balloon must have been detected before it reached U.S. airspace and like you said, should have been shot down once it was known to be entering our airspace. I remember reading somewhere (maybe your blog) about how the Japanese sent balloons with explosive devices over this country during WW2 and one actually came down in a remote area in the U.S.
I guess once they collect whatever debris they can recover, we may know what was inside the balloon (but I wouldn't be surprised if we are never told). It would be really funny if they find that the balloon was no more than a weather balloon as the Chinese claim.
I wonder if the one over Latin America is being directed over sensitive areas there (assuming there are any such "sensitive" areas).
The whole thing seems to be so bizarre to me.
That's the question I have. Why is this foreign device being allowed to operate, or drift, whatever the case may be, over United States airspace without any action being taken. Troubling.
It has been shot down. It has been reported that the equipment on the balloon is very heavy and from 60,000 feet difficult to predict the landing spot. Personally, I don't support 'shoot first, ask questions later.' In any case, that threat (?) is over.
A
Kevin, by now of course the balloon has been shot down, before sunset on Saturday Feb. 4. Debris could be seen streaking toward the sea. The reason this wasn't done over inhabited land is obvious because of the danger to anyone below.
Fighter jet and airline pilots from many nations over all the continents have reported UFOs/"UAPs, since the previous century, but primarily they've reported craft moving at high speeds (in 2004, one object traveled 60 miles in two seconds to another Air Force maneuver point off the California coast). The "tic-tacs" etc. also perform high speed changes in direction, sometimes at 90-degree angles or in reverse. They are tracked through naked eye observation (including from carriers at sea and by ground observers), satellite instruments, infrared and video on board aircraft. I trust the pilots have known the difference between balloons and these phenomenal craft. Pilots from points as disparate as Iran, Belgium, Japan, Alaska, UK, Canada and Latin America have reported structured craft carrying out movements beyond any current known human technology--far beyond it. At up to 30 miles per second, inside the atomosphere, if not more, they are not balloons.
Given a)the reports of swarms of drones in and near sensitive areas, and b) the numberof UAP reports ascribed to balloons...I wonder if these type of balloons serve as a sort of "mothership" for some type of small drones that are released when the balloon overflies an area of interest.
Reminds me of Fu-Go balloons.
NASA had a Long Duration Balloon Program and had worked on a Ultra Long Duration Balloon Program too. I recall the ability to change altitude to take advantage of different winds aloft to go different directions in a modest way.
But one thing is for sure is that there were safety concerns integrated in the design to prevent falling on people when it goes off course. Essentially letting the gas out of the balloon (duh). Guess the Chinese have not figured that out yet.
But really, using satellites to gather data is not perfect so you should not think there is no reason for stratospheric altitude data collection. Some sensors can detect various radioactive particles or emissions to help understand the characteristics of nuclear weapons or reactors and being in LEO or GEO is too far. For instance, would not the US love to be able to fly a sensor over the vast nuclear silos in China to see which are decoys and which have weapons? Also, the closer the photographic sensor is to the object imaged, the more resolution. Of course, the Chinese seem to have free rein to buy land or companies or send people into our country and next to military bases. I guess we are idiots.
It just disgusting it was not brought down with a laser in some controlled way on the ground rather than blow it up with a missile (duh) and now it is in the hard to get to Atlantic where piecing the parts together is going to be hard. Sometimes.....
The balloon's altitude required the use of a missile to shoot it down. The trouble is, missiles don't always work the way they're supposed to. A good example is the AIM 54 Phoenix missile that was carried by the F-14 Tomcat fighter plane. In at least two instances during combat, the missile was fired at a target but the rocket motor failed to ignite, and the missile fell to earth like a gravity bomb. This is not something you want to happen over land outside of a bombing test range.
Sorry, I don't buy this missile falling off the rails argument. The balloon could have been attacked over the wide open spaces in Alaska or in Montana. I also believe that using a 20 mm cannon would have accomplished the goal as well... but they you have fragments falling to the ground. Of course, over wide open spaces, that's not much of a hazard...
So, I still believe that they were worried about people on the ground being injured by brining down the balloon is a ridiculous claim.
Well, Kevin, by looking for a conspiracy or incompetence where there was none, you're going against the considered opinion of the Defense Dept. intelligence experts. Biden wanted it shot down last Wednesday, but DoD said it was best to do it over shallow water. By not falling onto hard ground from 12 miles up, the material has been salvaged and can be engineered, its data likely recovered.
As for what happened while the balloon drifted across the continent, the military jammed its signals and even dispersed high altitude materials to deflect the balloon sensors views of the ground. What material that was hasn't been disclosed for obvious reasons.
Revealed also by the Pentagon last week was that three balloons had passed over when Trump was president. THAT set of intelligence officials hadn't even detected them. Trump and his kids meanwhile had opened major business interests in China, so he wasn't likely to have done anything even had he known (his lies about "China virus" notwithstanding).
It seems to me that China is testing the tolerance of various governments to their little games.
To my knowledge, only the USA have shot one of these balloons down...and that might have been the point of the exercise in the first place.
Carter M -
Almost deleted the post because of the unnecessary political comment...
However, I thought I would point out that the original reason for not shooting down the balloon was because of possible injuries to those on the ground. So, they shot it down over water, but, of course, falling from great height into the ocean really is almost like dropping it on land. If it fell on land, they you don't have the recovery problems you have with an ocean landing. Not to mention the corrosive affects of salt water.
And, I really don't want to engage in political discourse here but would be remiss not to mention the Biden connections to China.
Kevin, my mention of Trump's intelligence and military officials not detecting the three balloons that passed over U.S. territory in their tenure was necessary, as a response to your very political blaming the current officials for making a decision differing from your perspective. I agree with others here that 60,000 pounds of payload, scattering over 15 by 15 football fields in area, was not a risk the military should have taken, over any land mass.
Respectfully, the evidence is clear that the whole hullaballon is being exaggerated for political purposes, truth be told, even in this blog.
Kevin -What the heck! It was just on the news that we shot down "an unknown object flying in US airspace near the coast of Alaska." They say the unidentified flying object (my term LOL) was about the size of a small car. They claim they did not know where it came from or what its purpose was. They are recovering the debris.
Can we do that? Can we just shoot down any object without identifying it? What if it was an innocent civilian plane? With all our technology these days how could they have not been able to identify the object?
Are we a country that shoots first and asks questions later? If so, why did we wait so long to shoot down the balloon?
This is a follow-up to my last post about the shooting down of an identified object off Alaska.
The news says fighter pilots visually examined the object and ascertained it was not manned. That means they must have gotten a very good look at it. Despite that good look, they still could not identify it?? Maybe we now have a bonafide shootdown of an extraterrestrial spacecraft which is not buried in secrecy which so many UFO investigators have claimed has happened in the past.
Carter M.
I was referring to the following comment by you. "Trump and his kids meanwhile had opened major business interests in China, so he wasn't likely to have done anything even had he known (his lies about "China virus" notwithstanding)." I could have mentioned Hunter Biden's trips to China and the evidence suggesting a payment from the Chinese but do not want this to devolve into political commentary, so any further mentions that have a political slant will be rejected.
My point was that the current officials allowed the balloon to travel the length of the US, gathering sigint or elint which puts the US at risk. I mentioned the dumb reason that the debris from the balloon might injury people on the ground as the reason when, since it had a 2000 pound payload (not the 60,000 pounds you suggest) meant it would fall pretty much straight down and they could have shot it down over any of the great, uninhabited areas of Montana or Wyoming (or Nebraska if you have ever driven along Interstate 80) without danger to people. My comment was that I found it strange that the news media didn't question this dumb reason.
Louis Nicholson -
Haven't posted your comments because they are out of date, meaning as of a few moments ago, the US and Canada intercepted and shot down a THIRD object. They haven't referred to it as a balloon. I believe, as I mentioned on Coast-to-Coast AM that I found the press conference sounding suspiciously like something from a science fiction film with the mention of the unidentified object being shot down and recovery operations are in progress.
News reports tonite cite pilots who saw object saying no visible propulsion and baffled by how it was flying
This story is getting more interesting by the day.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11741471/Montana-congressman-says-mystery-object-detected-Havre-remains-US.html
As I write, four objects seem to have been shot down in USA and Canada. Three seem to obviously be balloons...and one that is "cylindrical shape and no observable surveillance equipment attached." .... "the size of a small car".
Today, (Feb 12, 2023) Senator Chuck Schumer is saying the US now believes the last two objects were balloons. What?! The fighter pilots who observed the objects could not ascertain they were balloons???
Where have we heard that sort of thing before? Oh yes, Roswell when the US claimed the crashed object was just a weather balloon and Jesse Marcell was too incompetent too recognize it as such. I wonder if the military are now going to say the fighter pilots who saw the objects with their own eyes were too incompetent to recognize them as balloons.
And also, the Canadian defense minister was pretty adamant that the latest object was "cylindrical" in shape.
There is definitely something rotten in the state of Denmark as the old saying goes. . .
The news just reported that once again, today, Superbowl Sunday, the US has shot down another object, this time over Lake Huron.
Kevin, what are your thoughts about these objects might be?
Louis, The Guardian newspaper and others yesterday (11th) said the Canada object was a cylinder, "silvery-gray," and the Defense Minister said "it was much smaller than the balloon" shot down last week. She also said the attack was coordinated by both nations, one jet apiece from Canada and the U.S. NORAD is working the way it's supposed to. But so far, no confirmation it was a balloon, other than Schumer's comment.
The Sunday Feb. 12 object downed over Lake Huron was "octagonal." Still could be a balloon?
The MSM, here in the UK, are going all out to call these weather/spy balloons, "UFO's".
Funny how, all of a sudden, the term "UAP" is out of vogue this week.
I've pointed out in Daily Mail comments sections that this cylindrical object the "size of a car" that was shot down the other day, in no way compares to the "Tic Tac", Gimbal" and "Go Fast" UFO's reported by the US Navy, that could leave USN fighter jets for dead.
All to no avail, of course. The sheeple, as usual, don't want to know.
This is what i think is going on here and will probably keep happening until someone is brave enough to show a real alive or dead alien body to the news media....The military will aknowledge that some strange craft or objects were brought down because of this balloon that was used to spy on us and our weaponry, they will admit to the public during their news conferences they don't know what exactly was shot down, hell, they could be even extraterrestrial for all we know and later on once all the debris is recovered they will have another news conference saying all that was recovered was some super secret balloons with drone technology that they were not aware of (or maybe they were?) and could even attempt to explain the Roswell UFO crash of 1947 in that same way? I think something is up, and unless the end of the world is truly upon us, i find it strange they are indeed having these news conferences about objects being shot of the sky, and already i hear Chuck Schumer, a politician saying these were all just balloons that were shot out of the sky.....
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