Mike Rogers "Confesses" to the Hoax

 

When I learned that Mike Rogers had passed, I put a short note up on this blog. It wasn’t so much an obituary as a notice that he was gone. I shared some of my interactions with him which I believed to be of interest, but drew no real conclusions about the validity of some of the things he’d said in the past.

Mike Rogers. Photo Courtesy of Mike Rogers.

Charlie Wiser posted a comment to that article that said:

Mike Rogers' daughter took his confession on his death bed - he confessed (for the second time) to hoaxing the TW sighting with Travis, confirming his role at the fire tower (the UFO) - he was to stop at a certain viewing point for Travis to get out, then generate panic in the truck and drive away fast after the zapping, to leave the impression Travis was abducted. Given the various changes and contradictions in their stories over the years in response to skeptical pushback, this version fits the actual facts.

Mike also confessed to the first part of the Phoenix Lights (V-shape) in which he was so interested for the past 20 years. If we read his "speculation" as confession - a lightweight wire-and-plastic construction lifted by helium, with DEFINITELY!! exactly 7 lights no matter what people reported, released near Prescott that traveled with the wind speed and direction to Casa Grand - we might solve that part of the sighting. He agrees the second part was flares.

Before I announced on Coast-to-Coast AM that Rogers was gone, I had read the comment. I told the executive producer about it with the caveat that I had not had a chance to vet the information and I wasn’t comfortable mentioning the hoax claim. I did know about some of the acrimony between Travis Walton and Mike Rogers and I knew they had put it behind them. So, I just made the announcement about Rogers’s passing on air and let it go at that.

Travis Walton at the Roswell UFO Festival.

Now I have the other side of the story, which has done nothing to resolve the issue, but does give us, well, a different perspective. André Skondras posted the following that is relevant:

Somewhere In The Skies podcaster Ryan Sprague shared Jennifer Stein’s response regarding Mike Rogers’ alleged deathbed confession about the Travis Walton case. Stein has a wonderful documentary called “Travis: The True Story of Travis Walton.”

“I think it’s incredibly disrespectful to tamper with Mike’s final statements. I do not believe he made any kind of deathbed confession, because filmmaker Patrick James visited him three days before his passing and got a completely different story directly from Mike. Patrick James, an Arizona filmmaker, will be releasing a documentary about the Walton case soon.

‘If this were truly a final statement, why didn’t his daughter post the audio? Why just a text, and then take it down? A lot of things don’t add up. I don’t believe it’s a legitimate post. I suspect it’s Charlie Wiser trying one last time to convince the world that the Walton case is a hoax. I find this behavior sad and disrespectful. I had very nice, respectful texts with Mike Rogers in the weeks before he passed, and he never mentioned any of this.’”

[https://youtube.com/.../UgkxJkWlurO32s0SAlrY...](https://youtube.com/.../UgkxJkWlurO32s0SAlrY...)

Full interview:

[https://www.youtube.com/live/iNo6BqnzY2Q...](https://www.youtube.com/live/iNo6BqnzY2Q...)

[https://x.com/likeitmatters3/status/2036941617685553567?s=43](https://x.com/likeitmatters3/status/2036941617685553567?s=43)

But to repudiate this information, Wiser published the following to the comments of the previous post. “His daughter published a summary of it on Quora - she says it was recorded. She's deleted the post now but a screenshot is on my Twitter. She's currently deciding how best to release the information.”

Although this is evidence that she posted it, that she has since deleted is currently significant. That she said that there was a recording is also significant, as is the fact that the information is no longer available to us. Without that recording, we aren’t left with much evidence expect the apparent fact that she did post it.

I confess that I’m confused by all this and it is something that happens far too often in the UFO field. I can’t count the number of times that I have run into this sort of thing. Two completely different points of view proving that a certain case is a hoax and the other underscoring the importance and validity of the event. Just look at the rumors, half-truths and outright lies that surround the Roswell crash case.

On the other hand, it is often important that we have all the information about a case, a report, a statement that illustrates the conflict so that we might come to a conclusion that fits our belief structure. This means that some who know that there is no alien visitation believe any UFO sighting that isn’t a mistaken view of natural world phenomena about us is a hoax. On the other side are the true believers who accept any story about alien visitation no matter how outlandish that claim might be.

I try to fall in the middle of that continuum because I don’t know that alien visitation is impossible but that I would like some stronger evidence proving that visitation. Here is an example of what I mean because there are two camps. Either Walton was abducted by aliens or he invented the tale with some help.

I could argue either side of the debate because the published information. Philip Klass’s attack on the case is filled with holes, but there are contradictions in Walton’s story as well. There are Roger’s statements that no one saw Walton abducted because they had driven off. So, where was he for those five days? It is a case of I just don’t know.

But the point here is that the tale of a “deathbed confession” by Rogers doesn’t seem to be accurate. That, of course, leaves us right where we were when we entered the debate. Logic suggests it must be a hoax given the problems of interstellar travel and some of the best evidence suggests that Walton was “taken.” To draw a proper conclusion, we simply need more and better information.

'X' zone Broadcast Network - Jen Stein on Travis Walton

 

This week’s guest was Jennifer Stein, who is responsible for the documentary, Travis, about, what else, the Travis Walton abduction. This came about because of things that Mike Rogers had said, not only on this program, but what he said to others. In one case, Rogers had said that the whole thing was a hoax, only to retract that statement, in a matter of speaking not long after making it. I had reached out to various colleagues to solicit opinions on this, and ended up speaking with Stein. I thought she would make an interesting counter to some of what Rogers had said. You can listen to the program here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/46966498

One of the things we discussed was the Steven Pierce tale that Philip Klass had offered him, that is Pierce, ten thousand dollars to admit to the hoax. You’ll remember just a couple of weeks ago I talked to Robert Sheaffer about that. Sheaffer

had said that he’d read a transcript of the conversations between Klass and Pierce and it seemed that no such offer had been made. It was just some sort of a misunderstanding because of a rumor allegedly started by Rogers. I hadn’t seen the transcripts at that time but Sheaffer was sure that his interpretation was the correct one. Stein wasn’t so sure. I have added the transcripts at the end of this post for those who wish to read them can do so. I’ll be interested in what each of you thinks, having listened to the show and seen the transcripts.

But I also have to mention that there may have been communication from Klass to Pierce through the local police department. So, when Klass mentions they had never met or talked with one another, that was the truth. Once again, we have a conflict about what happened, when it happened and how it happened. It really comes down do who you wish to believe about all this.

I also mentioned that I had no trust in James Harder, having worked with him in 1976 on an abduction investigation. I saw Harder manipulating the situation between the recorded hypnotic regression sessions. He provided the script in the guise of attempting to provide comfort to the witness. He mentioned to me that his job was to validate the Barney and Betty Hill abduction case by finding another, credible case. I would have thought that his job was to find the truth.

He provided information between the sessions that appeared in the next session. He mentioned to the witness that Betty Hill thought she had been physically examined and in the very next session with the witness, the witness said that she knew she had been examined. Stein pointed out that Harder had but one session with Walton and there really had been no opportunity for him to influence Walton’s memories of the event. Stein thought the session was more of a relaxation exercise because, for Walton, the abduction was quite stressful. In other words, Harder’s part of the story was small and probably unimportant.

For those interested, you can visit Jen Stein’s website about Travis, the documentary she produced here:

TravisWaltonTheMovie.com

And for those interested in the Virtual Conference that will be held on November 6, you can find information about it here:

TheObservation.com

Next week, I’ll talking with Nick Redfern about his latest book, Time Travel. And the following week, for those of you who don’t think I was fair when I interviewed Bob Young, I’ll be chatting with Stan Gordon. We’ll get his take on all this, meaning the Kecksburg UFO crash. Stan had been investigating the case for decades.

Click on the document to expand... Klass' transcript of his telephone conversation with Steve Pierce.

'X' Zone Broadcast Network = Robert Sheaffer

You might say that I view Robert Sheaffer as the resident skeptic on the program because, while we disagree on many topics, we can discuss those disagreements in a civilized fashion. This week, he and I talked about some of the current topics in the world of the UFO. You can listen to the show here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/46641154

In the last few months there has been a discussion about the Travis Walton abduction and we began with that topic. Mike Rogers has said that he was through with Walton, that the story was a hoax, that the UFO sighting was real and that no one saw Walton abducted. Rogers also reversed himself on a number of these points.

Robert Sheaffer

Sheaffer and I talked about the story that Philip Klass had offered Steven Pierce ten thousand dollars to say that the story was a hoax. Sheaffer was of the opinion that the original claim had come, not from Pierce, but from Rogers. Sheaffer, who had researched the story in the personal papers of Klass held in an archive, said that he seen a transcript of the first telephone call between Klass and Pierce. This came about after the allegation about the bribe was made in a book. From the transcript, Shaeffer said that it seemed both men had been surprised by the allegation. Sheaffer was certain that no such offer had been made.

I did ask if a tape of the conversation existed, but Sheaffer wasn’t sure. Apparently, there are some tapes in the archive. Sheaffer said that not all that long ago someone had asked for permission to review the material, but was told that the archive was closed and would be for about a year. That, of course, didn’t answer the question. Given the controversy, it would be nice if the tape did exist, but in my experience, I have been accused of altering tapes, editing tapes, and leaving out critical statements when a witness was confronted with words that he or she didn’t like… even when they heard themselves uttering the phrases, they claimed they hadn’t uttered.

Just last week, I talked with a person familiar with the story who said that the offer was made in a Western Union Telegram, which could render the telephone transcript as irrelevant. There seems to be no evidence that Klass had ever used Western Union to make such an offer. That allegation seemed to be stretching the point to breaking.

We did get deep into the weeds about the exact location of the abduction part of the Walton incident with a suggestion, that has been raised by others, the site has been moved so that a fire watch tower could be used to create the light show for those in the truck with Rogers. Of course, Rogers, when I spoke with him didn’t accept the idea.

I also wanted to talk about some skeptics accepting any solution to a sighting no matter how ridiculous that explanation might be. Although I used Levelland as an example, we did talk about the Lubbock Lights. Sheaffer said that an analysis of the photos showed that two of the pictures, when set one on top of the other suggested that the lights had not moved in relation to one another. For those who wish to learn more about that, you can read it here:

https://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread906605/pg1#pid15505257

I have, in the past, discussed these pictures at length, including my interview with the photographer, Carl Hart, Jr. You can read that posting here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2006/08/carl-hart-and-lubbock-lights.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/01/historys-project-blue-book-lubbock.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2021/04/carl-hart-jr-lubbock-lights.html

Sheaffer did mention the Coast Guard pictures taken in 1952. There has been an explanation offered for what caused the lights. Here Sheaffer took up a skeptical argument, meaning that he was skeptical of the explanation.

The Salem, MA, Coast Guard Picture.

You can find more information at his blog:

www.BadUFOs.com

Finally, we talked about the artifact, either natural or artificial that had passed through the Solar System not all that long ago. I’ve talked with Dr. Loeb about it on this show a couple of times and you can listen to those shows here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2021/07/galileo-project-and-avi-loeb.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2021/01/x-zone-broadcast-network-dr-abraham-avi.html

Next week, I’ll be talking to Rob Mercer about his discovery of some of the Project Blue Book files and the fact that he found a complete index with all the names in it. In the publicly released version, all the names had been redacted. 

'X' Zone Broadcast Network - Mike Rogers Talking about the Walton Abduction

Because of the latest controversy surrounding the Travis Walton abduction, I reached out to Mike Rogers, who was there when the UFO was seen. He had been an important voice in the sighting report for more than four decades. You can listen to my interview with him here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/46433727

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/46434231

We spent the first interview discussing the whole story from the moment that Rogers and Walton saw the UFO and the men with them, Steve Pierce, Allen Dalis, John Goulette, Ken Peterson, and Dwayne Smith, until they returned to look for Walton after the abduction. It is the story as it has been told many times but here, we hear it from one of the men who was there in 1975. We covered the search for Walton and the law enforcement reaction to the story. I wanted to cover all this for everyone to have, well, the proper perspective on this classic UFO case.

I will note here, because Rogers said it several times, that no one saw Walton abducted. They all saw the craft, but they had fled after Walton had been struck by the beam. Rogers said that he hadn’t seen the beam, but had seen Walton flying through the air.

As the hour expired, we talked about the lie detector tests. Rogers said something about a first test in California but he didn’t know the results or the details. There was a second test, apparently arranged by Jim and Coral Lorenzen of APRO for those at the National Enquirer, which Walton failed. Rogers wasn’t clear if this was the California test, or there had been an earlier test. I suspect that they are the same or the one in California never happened.

We came back to the lie detector tests. Walton passed a second one (third?) arranged by the Lorenzens. It seems they rejected the first test(s) because they had been given too soon after Walton’s return. That his shock at the events might have skewed the results and frankly, I’m willing to accept that explanation. The Lorenzens are to be faulted because they denied the first failed test until Philip Klass learned about it. This, of course, is not a reflection on Walton.

In 1993, Jerry Black, a somewhat disinterested third party, arranged still another lie detector test for Walton. This one seems to have been conducted without a particular bias, and Walton passed it.

We stayed with the lie detector test question a little longer. A number of years ago, Walton appeared on a show called, Moment of Truth. He was asked if he had been abducted by a UFO and he answered, “Yes.” The polygrapher determined that his answer was a lie.

According to Rogers, Steve Pierce, who was there, at the taping of the show, changed his mind about the Walton abduction. In fact, and according to Rogers, of all the men who were there in 1975, apparently only John Goulette still believes that abduction part of the story. I must note here that two of the men who were there in 1975 have since died.

I asked Rogers his reaction to that test but he kept talking about the money that Walton and others had earned at the show. The answer I finally got was that Rogers believed the UFO sighting because he had been there and seen the UFO, but he said, again, that no one actually saw Walton abducted.

Steve Pierce

It had seemed, for years, that the men presented a solid front, with no one breaking ranks. Steve Pierce had been pressed by Philip Klass to admit it was a hoax for ten thousand dollars. Pierce’s friends suggested that if he took the money, he would be bruised and he’d spend it alone (Yes, there is a quote to that effect in the interview). I saw that as something of a threat. I mentioned pressure from both sides to get Pierce to do what they wanted. You can read my interview with Pierce that covers this point here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/07/steve-pierce-and-travis-walton.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/03/philip-klass-travis-walton-and-steve.html

And if you scroll down in the following story, you’ll find a little additional information. You can read it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/09/project-aquarius-steve-pierce-and-other.html 

We also talked about the transcript going around in which Rogers is quoted as saying that the story was a hoax. I asked about this and Rogers said that he never said anything like that. He said that the audio interview he’d had with Ryan Gordon had been manipulated to change the meaning. I have not heard the interview but have seen the transcript. That’s something that Rogers and Gordon will have to work out.

What comes out of these two hours with Mike Rogers is that the once solid wall for the Walton abduction is not as solid as it once was. Rogers was somewhat evasive when I asked specific questions about the reality of the abduction and if he believed that Walton had been abducted. He repeated that he had seen the UFO but that no one saw Walton abducted. Is there something that he’s not telling us? You can, quite naturally, listen to the interview and decide for yourself but I will say, this turned somewhat troubling for me.

Next up is Robert Sheaffer. We’ll talk about UFO skepticism and maybe touch his opinion of the Walton abduction.

  

X-Zone Broadcast Network - Peter Robbins

 

Peter Robbins was my guest this week. As I explained, I invited him on after I had read a posting in which he was defending Travis Walton. I think most of you know by now that Walton and Mike Rogers have been in a bit of a disagreement about the validity of the Walton abduction. My conversation with Peter, before the show, evolved to the point where we thought it might be more interesting to talk about the investigative process. You can listen to the show here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/46239415

We did delve into the Rendlesham Forest case, though that hadn’t been my intention. We got some insight into how Peter was drawn into the case and his thinking over the years. We didn’t talk much about Larry Warren and his involvement, though we do touch on some of that.

Peter Robbins

One of the things that we did sort of dwell on was the number of nights of the event. I had just finished a rewrite, update, and revision of my two decades old book, Project Moon Dust. Like many others, I have been confused about the number of days for the event, but had straightened that out in my mind. The problem was that the episode for which Rendlesham Forest is known began on the night of December 25 but carried on until after midnight on December 26. That was day one. Day two began in the evening of December 26 and carried on until after midnight on December 27. The last part began on the evening of December 27, though activity carried on until after midnight, everyone views that as December 27. As I say, confusing.

Peter told of his first trip to England and to Rendlesham Forest in which he witnessed some of the strange things that happen there. John Burroughs had told me that strange things were happening there before the December 1980 events and continue on until today.

We did talk about investigations and Peter talked about his learning methods while associated with a New York police detective and later with Budd Hopkins. He talked about following one aspect of the case until it played out and then following another and of course, another which is interviewing the witnesses. He was building the case on multiple legs. What he was talking about is what I call multiple chains of evidence… pictures and radar and landing traces and witness testimony. The best cases have these multiple chains of evidence.

On a side trip, I mentioned the illustrations of the aliens made by Pat Roach after her abduction. I thought it interesting, and apropos of nothing at all, that her artistic talent increased under hypnotic regression. I also 

thought appropriate I gave her a green felt tip pen to make the drawings. You can see the difference yourself.

Finally, we talked about the death of James Forrestal, who was the first Secretary of Defense. We did examine the history that went into the creation of the Department of Defense, and how Forrestal had served in the public arena until his mental breakdown. Although history tells us that Forrestal committed suicide, Peter suggested the evidence he examined suggested murder. He makes a compelling case for drawing that conclusion.

Next week, I’ll be talking with Dr. Abraham (Avi) Loeb about his Galileo Project and the detection of the object that he is convinced is an alien artifact. Should be an interesting discussion.

X-Zone - The Latest on Travis Walton's Abduction

 For those living under rocks, who haven’t gotten out of the basement, or who, though some miracle, have avoided social media, let me tell you that the cracks in the Travis Walton abduction case have widened into deep fissures. This all began a

Travis Walton

while back when Mike Rogers announced that he was through with Travis Walton. At that time, because I have communicated with both men, I asked a couple of questions because it seem the split had nothing to do with the abduction tale. Oh, Rogers had mentioned, several times that no one saw Walton abducted, but that wasn’t really much of a revelation and proved nothing. For those interested in seeing my take on this, you can read about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2021/03/did-mike-rogers-repudiate-travis-walton.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2021/04/coast-to-coast-am-travis-walton-and.html

This latest exchange, which was hosted by Erica Lukes on her podcast UFOs Unclassified, began with an interview with Mike Rogers and ended with a discussion with Ryan Gordon. The Rogers end of the interview was, to be kind, slightly incoherent and the Gordon bit was quite illustrative. Gordon does raise some interesting points about the whole case. You can find all four hours of the show here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtWgwN2hzOA

Peter Robbins, who might be best known as one of the authors of a book on the Rendlesham Forest case that involved a number of Air Force personnel in December 1980, has posted an alternative view of the Walton abduction, which you can read here:

https://www.facebook.com/668953372/posts/10159496184383373/?d=n

And before we get too deep into this, I’ll point out that I interviewed Steve Pierce, who was one of those who was there when Walton was abducted. It might interesting to compare what he told me with some of the information coming out now. You can read about that interview here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/07/steve-pierce-and-travis-walton.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/03/philip-klass-travis-walton-and-steve.html

I was asked by Rob McConnell to provide my take on this latest episode. I confess that I find it disturbing. It seems to me, that after all these years, decades really, that the pot is being stirred again. Rogers seems, to me, to be a loose cannon at this point. Walton, it seems to me, it a little more rock solid. But this latest information, supplied by Ryan Gordon, has caused quite the stir. You can listen to Rob McConnell and me talk about it on his X-Zone show found here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/45809038

There is one other aspect of this that I do want to mention. That is the lie detector tests that have been given. The members of the wood cutting crew were all, with a single exception, given lie detector tests while Walton was still missing. They all passed, but there really weren’t questions about the abduction. The focus was on the possibility that Walton had been murdered.

Once Walton reappeared, he was given a lie detector test arranged by APRO’s International Director, Jim Lorenzen. Walton failed that test but Walton told me that

Jim Lorenzen

it was the polygraph's fault and the test hadn’t been fairly administered. Because the operator didn’t believe the story, that influenced the test and I have to say that such a charge makes sense.Phil

This wouldn’t be of interest, but Lorenzen, at first, denied that such a test had been given. Philip Klass revealed that bit of information harming the credibility of the case and doing some damage to Jim Lorenzen’s reputation.

Other tests, given later, had positive results. Jerry Black arranged for them in the 1990s. You can read about this later test here:

http://www.ufoevidence.org/documents/doc348.htm

And you can read more about the Walton abduction from some divergent points of view here:

http://www.nicap.org/751105snowflake_dir.htm

http://www.nicap.org/reports/751105snowflake_report.htm

If all this isn’t enough to overwhelm you, I don’t know what it. Like so much of the UFO field, there is a variety of points for view from the debunker’s “It can’t be, therefore it isn’t,” to the other side of the spectrum which is “What more do you need for proof?”

The Walton case is one of the few in which the abduction was witnessed (well, almost… Rogers said that no one witnessed the actual abduction) and that makes it a stronger case. We had, what was once, a solid wall of confirmation by those involved, that now has developed a few cracks that have become wider and deeper.

I confess that at this point I am more confused than ever. Those who visit here regularly know that I’m not a fan of abduction tales. I have said that I think the more likely abduction scenarios are those like the Walton experience in which the “victim” is a target of opportunity rather than a participant in some sort of long-term longitudinal study. I had, provisionally, accepted the story as true but had some reservations about it. This latest pushes me in the other direction and given that a hoax scenario is more likely than an alien abduction, that seems to be the most likely case… but I just don’t really know for sure.

Next up on my radio show/podcast is my interview with Robert Sheaffer. I had thought we’d talk about the UAP report and the latest from the Navy, but given all this about Walton, we’ll discuss that as well. If you have questions, append them here. Since I moderate the comments, they won’t be published.  

Coast-to-Coast AM: Travis Walton and Mike Rogers

A few days ago, I stumbled across a number of blog postings about the Travis Walton abduction, suggesting that there was now a problem between Walton and Mike Rogers. The suggestion, or the interpretation of some of those remarks, suggested that Rogers was repudiating the abduction and had stopped just short of calling it a hoax.

Travis Walton.

Now, those who know me and have read my work in the UFO field know that I’m not a fan of abduction tales. I understand the logistical problems with interstellar flight and that the vast distances, not to mention the current thinking that the speed of light is the limiting factor, suggest that travel among the stars is something that would take years, if not decades and centuries. I get that our current knowledge is subject to revision as our understanding of the universe increases, but that doesn’t change the fact that interstellar flight is, basically, impossible for us under today’s laws of physics.

That doesn’t mean that a civilization that is a hundred years, two years or a thousand years more advanced than our own hasn’t figured out a way to do it. That means, to my way of thinking that alien visitation, and by extension, alien abduction is possible. I believe that many cases of alien abduction have terrestrial explanations.

There are two distinct factors are work here. One is sleep paralysis, which is a period just prior to going to sleep or just after waking when the individual cannot move. It is a frightening experience for those who have never suffered an episode of sleep paralysis. In about 80% of the cases, there is also the feeling that there is something, some entity or creature in the room as well.

There are several cases in which sleep paralysis, when fully explored offers an explanation for the abduction case. You can read about this, at length, in The Abduction Enigma.

The second problem, often related to sleep paralysis, is the use of hypnosis to gather the data. By reading the transcripts of some of the sessions, you can see where the operator, that is the hypnotist, is unconsciously leading the subject into the arena of alien abduction. Again, The Abduction Enigma covers that. You can also read more about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2011/02/response-to-budd-hopkins.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2016/09/x-zone-broadcast-network-carol-rainey.html

I believe that the most likely scenarios are those of what I think of as targets of opportunity such as the Barney and Betty Hill, the Charles Hickson and Calvin Parker, the Terry Lovelace case, and, of course, the Walton abduction. I believe these are more likely alien abduction than many of the other cases. You can listen to my interviews with Calvin Parker and with Terry Lovelace here (or just scroll through the listings on the embedded audio player on the left to find those interviews):

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/03/x-zone-broadcast-network-calvin-parker.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2020/07/x-zone-broadcast-network-calvin-parker.html

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/17671590

Having read about the fallout between Travis Walton and Mike Rogers that seemed to suggest something new was coming. As I said, it seemed that Rogers was close to repudiating Walton.

I know each man having met each of them on several occasions. I reached out to Mike Rogers asking about all this. It seemed to me that he was suggesting that the fallout was a personal matter that seemed to relate to the abduction only tangentially. He wasn’t repudiating it by saying he was done with Travis Walton, only that his association with Walton was terminated. That seemed to clarify the matter.

But then he sent an email that reminded me that no one had actually seen Walton being abducted. When the men in the pick-up truck spotted the UFO near where they had been working, rogers, who was driving, stopped. They were all in a state of shock by the brightly glowing UFO that was not all that far from them. Travis, fascinated by the craft, got out of the truck and begin walking toward it. As he got near, a bright beam of light shot out, striking him. He was thrown back, landing on the ground some distance away.

The others, still in the truck and in an even more agitated state, didn’t check on their friend. They screamed at Rogers to get them out of there. Rogers turned around and sped away. I actually mentioned to Rogers once that I found that a little bit chicken… but, of course they did return. This is the reason, that in the beginning, law enforcement thought they might have murdered Walton.

We know, of course, that wasn’t true. Walton reappeared some five days later, calling friends to come and get him. According to what Rogers told me some time ago Walton only remembered about fifteen minutes of his time on the ship. Rogers worked out the details based on what he was told.

What I learned in my communications with both men, was that all this had to do with personal matters. It had nothing to do with the UFO sighting and those events. Rogers wasn’t about to claim the whole thing was a hoax. He was annoyed with Travis and it seemed that Travis was annoyed with him.

I told both that I was going to report on this and that, having my questions answered, I was going to bow out of the conversation. This really was none of my business and it was not the business of those in the UFO community. The suggestion of some sort of repudiation of the abduction and by extension, the UFO sighting was not on the table.

On Monday I learned that they have, apparently, worked out their differences. For those interested, I have more information on my blog about the sighting and even an interview with one of the other men in the truck, Steve Pierce. It should supply a complete picture and wrap up this latest episode. 

Did Mike Rogers Repudiate the Travis Walton Abduction?

 

There has been a bit of a controversy lately. Travis Walton and Mike Rogers are at odds with one another and some have interpreted this to mean that Rogers no longer supports the story of Walton’s abduction. I read a number of posts about it and they were confusing. It was unclear if Rogers was saying, finally, that the abduction was a hoax, or maybe something less exciting. His words were that he no longer supported Travis Walton.

Travis Walton

I know Rogers to some extent. We have communicated over the last couple of years. I did meet him once, in 1997, in Roswell. Nothing long and involved. He and Walton were finishing a presentation and the next person up was Russ Estes. I was there with Estes and we all just said, “Hello.” Walton and Rogers left before Estes took the microphone and began to speak.

I have had Rogers on my radio show and you can listen to that interview by scrolling through the listings on the embedded audio player. Just look for Mike Rogers. I believe there is a problem with one segment in the first or second hour of the interview that we failed to get fixed. You can read about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/09/x-zone-broadcast-network-mike-rogers.html

Anyway, I emailed Rogers about all this. I thought I understood the situation. It seemed that Walton and Rogers had a falling out over a personal matter. It was strong enough that Rogers wasn’t going to support Walton, which I took to mean that he wasn’t going to be with him on any interviews or at any presentations. It wasn’t that Rogers was repudiating the abduction tale. He was severing his connection to Walton over this personal matter.

However, during the email exchange, Rogers sent the following, “You must realize that none of us witnesses saw Travis get abducted.  That in itself speaks volumes. The further this goes the more I wonder.” The emphasis is in the original. He added, “You can quote me on that.”

Yes, we can say that they all passed polygraph tests, or rather most of them did. But those first tests were about the Rogers’ team having murdered Walton and not about the abduction. Walton failed his first polygraph but subsequently passed two others. Walton has said that the first test was flawed because the polygrapher didn’t believe in UFOs and thought the whole thing was a hoax. The alleged test wasn’t a properly conducted test. Walton has a point here. You can, of course, read all about that in Walton’s Fire in the Sky.

Steve Pierce Photo copyright by Randle

I did talk with Steve Pierce several years ago about this, and the story that he and Philip Klass had talked about Pierce recanting. Klass would pay ten thousand dollars for that. I covered all this years ago and you can read about that here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/07/steve-pierce-and-travis-walton.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/03/philip-klass-travis-walton-and-steve.html

I will note here that none of those who were involved in the sighting and the subsequent events that night has ever said that it was a hoax. All have remained a solid front about the case. The statement by Rogers to me just hours ago is the first crack in the wall. You have to wonder about the line, “You must realize that none of us witnesses saw Travis get abducted.” Is there a deeper meaning hidden there?

When I began this minor quest, I had hoped clarify the situation but I now fear that I have muddied the water even more. I’m not sure what to make of all this?

And, I have reached out to Walton although he hasn’t answered an email from me in a couple of years. I had invited him on the radio show but his last comment was, “What’s the point?” I have not heard back from him, but then, I didn’t send the email all that long ago. If there is a reply, I’ll post it too.

Coast to Coast - Calvin Parker

 

Those of you who visit here regularly know that I’m not a big fan of tales of alien abduction. I believe that the solution for most cases is based here on Earth and that some of the investigation has been less than stellar. I do think that if there are alien abductions, I believe they would be targets of opportunity rather than some sort of longitudinal study conducted over years or decades. As I have said to Kathleen Marden, I’m more inclined to accept the tales told by Barney and Betty Hill, Travis Walton, and Charles Hickson and Calvin Parker.

For those interested, I have interviewed Calvin Parker of Pascagoula fame, a couple of times on the radio version of A Different Perspective. You can listen to those interviews here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/03/x-zone-broadcast-network-calvin-parker.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2020/07/x-zone-broadcast-network-calvin-parker.html

Like many others, I have always been somewhat skeptical of single witness reports, or in the case of Hickson-Parker, two guys telling the same story from the same point of view. That means they were together and there didn’t seem to be any corroborating witnesses. In the case of the latest investigation by Philip Mantle, it seems that additional witnesses have

Calvin Parker

been uncovered, and Calvin and I talked about that in the second link listed above.

But now, however, their seems to be some additional corroboration. Rather than witnesses who appeared nearly fifty years after the fact, there is a document found by Mantle that was written literally hours after the abduction took place. Mantle wrote:

After the book was published [Pascagoula – The Closest Encounter: My Story by Calvin Parker] … I continued my search for any formal documentation related to the incident as any that had been in the possession of Calvin Parker had been washed away by hurricane Katrina. I contacted all of the major UFO groups one of which included the J. Allen Hynek Center for UFO Studies in the USA. They were very obliging and sent me a PDF file of what they had on the case. Most of what they sent was newspaper cuttings but buried in the middle of this file was a very curious and possible ‘smoking gun’ type-written document.

Although this document, dated 13^th of October 1973, just two days after the alien encounter, is unsigned it was written by Dr. James Harder. We know it was written by Dr. Harder as he was the only person to examine the witnesses which has been confirmed by Calvin Parker. Dr. James Harder’s academic credentials are as follows: BS (Caltech), MS, Ph.D., (U.C. Berkeley). He is a Fellow, AAAS; Life Member, ASCE; and Founding Member, Society for Scientific Exploration. Professor Emeritus, U.C. Berkeley. He was also a director of the UFO research group APRO.

Dr. Harder along with Dr J. Allen Hynek were on site in Pascagoula within 36 hours of the event happening. They interviewed Calvin Parker and Charles Hickson and at a press conference confirmed that they believed what the witnesses were saying.

It is important, in attempting to understand, the relevance of the document, to read first, what Calvin had to say about it:

At the time of my abduction on October 11^th, 1973   when the alien reached out to take me on board the ship. From the first time I saw them it was the fear I felt that is hard to describe. I just knew I would not live through this fear. As the alien made contact to my left arm, I heard a whisk of what I thought was air then all at once I got became really relaxed then all the fear was gone. Later on, after being examined by Dr. James Harder I heard him telling Dr Hynek that I had a puncture marks on my arm and later at the hospital I found out that I was given not one shot but two shots the second was while I was on board the craft. This document simply confirms what I have always known and that is both Charlie and I were given injections by these creatures and we had the puncture wounds to prove it.

Rather than me type in what is found on the document, the best course is to provide the document itself so that you can read it here.

Document found by Philip Mantle.

 Although the provenance of the document is not rock solid, the fact that it came from CUFOS and was among Hynek’s papers is relevant. It’s not as if the document appeared from an unknown location in the mail box of a UFO researcher. It does have a certainly level of credibility attached to it.

However, it would have been more powerful had it been signed by Dr. James Harder, and given what is known, it is reasonable to believe that Harder was the author. Given what is known, given the date of the document, it does provide us with some corroboration for the event told by Calvin Parker. It is up to each of us to decide what weight to give to it.

X-Zone Broadcast Network - Mike Rogers (Walton Abduction and the Phoenix Lights)

This week I talked with Mike Rogers to get his take on the Travis Walton abduction, since he was one of the main players. He was completely candid in his responses and didn’t even mind my somewhat snarky question about them leaving Travis behind after being struck by the light beam. According to Mike, once the beam hit Travis, the other six took off in the truck. To their credit, they did stop and turn around to go back, but by that time, Travis was gone. You can listen to that interview here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/19005838

Although I had planned to talk about Mike’s involvement in the Phoenix Lights, we stayed with the abduction. I got his personal take on some of the events around that, learned that there had been a large-scale search for Travis and then the ultimate ending to the search when the sheriff suggested that they had murdered Travis. The lie detector said otherwise, and, of course Travis’ reappearance some five days later put that theory to bed.

We also talked, briefly, about Philip Klass’ involvement in the case, and his attempts to convince Steve Pierce, another of those with Travis that night, to admit the hoax. I had interviewed Pierce a number of years about this. You can read that here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/07/steve-pierce-and-travis-walton.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/03/philip-klass-travis-walton-and-

steve.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/09/project-aquarius-steve-pierce-and-other.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/07/travis-walton-and-me.html

One of the things that did intrigue me was the paintings that Mike had done based on the information supplied by Travis. I had thought that the beings described by Travis didn’t look much like the Grays of fame and Zeta Reticuli, but Mike thought they did look similar. I asked for, and was granted permission to reproduce his paintings here so that you might make up your own mind.

Travis Walton abduction as painted by Mike Rogers. Painting copyright by Mike Rogers, reprinted here by permission.

Given the timing, as the show wrapped up, we had not gotten to the Phoenix Lights, so I told him that we’d to that another time. Fortunately, the was a hole in the production schedule so that I had the opportunity to continue the interview right there. Now I learned that Mike had been on the scene of the Phoenix Lights, but what he saw was something different than what had been reported in the major of the stories. He saw a craft and not just lights in the distance.

I had been of the opinion that there had been two events on that night in 1997. One of them was of some kind of a structured craft that traveled the length of Arizona and the other was of the lights over Phoenix. We agreed that the Lights were flares dropped as part of military training, and that one formation of lights was of aircraft. Although Mike had no explanation for the structured craft, he did believe that it was of terrestrial manufacture. You can listen to all that here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/19005920

Next week, I’ll talk with Nick Redfern about his latest UFO book. He seems to be intent on writing more UFO books than either me or Brad Steiger. Given his age and mine, I’m sure that he’ll grab this “honor” at some point in the near future.

If you have questions for Nick, send them in the form of a comment and I’ll try to get them asked. For Mike, there were a couple of questions, but they came in while I was interviewing him, and didn’t have the chance to find them until the show ended.