Nick Pope Revisited

 

Let’s start again. I was a little disturbed about the allegations slung at Nick Pope by Dr. David Clarke recently and that Nick Pope had not had the opportunity to respond to them. I also want to point out that I have no dog in this fight and was looking for a little fairness in all this. I expected some pushback, but, in this world today, who wouldn’t expect some pushback. I have now heard from a number of others about all this.

First, I suppose, is to answer the question of why Dr. David Clarke would bring this up now, if the issue had been settled decades earlier. According to what he told me; the simple answer is that he didn’t. He was responding to a question asked by Martin Willis during Willis’ podcast.

Nick Redfern - Photo copyright by
Kevin Randle

Second, all those who emailed me seemed to object to my use of the term “allegations” against Nick Pope. All who emailed me said that there had been no allegations, just statement of facts. One of those facts, an important one, had to do with Nick Pope’s duty at the MoD and whether or not he, Nick Pope, had conducted official UFO investigations. While serving in the MoD, Nick Pope had other duties and devoted only 20% of his salary to dealing with UFOs. In other words, the majority of his time went to other things. His UFO duties involved taking down the initial information about a UFO sighting and then passing it on to another organization. To quote Nick Redfern (and now you know why I kept saying Nick Pope), back in 1994, Nick Pope told Nick Redfern, “There is no specific ‘UFO budget,’ except the staff costs, i.e. around 20% of my salary, together with a tiny percent of some other salaries, reflecting my line management’s supervisory role.”

For those interested, here is a link to an article an Nick Redfern published a number of years ago that dealt with some of this:

https://mysteriousuniverse.org/2018/08/u-k-government-ufo-research-the-real-picture/

That, of course, does not rule out Nick Pope having investigated UFO sightings. It suggests that there wasn’t much of a budget for any investigation. It could be said that the initial intake of information over the telephone is part of an investigation, though certainly not the most important aspect of it. However, there is additional information that is relevant to the discussion.

David Clarke noted in communication with me, “Sec(AS) [Secretariat Air Staff] where Nick worked 1991 – 1993 was not authorized or funded to investigate UFO reports.”

That seems to be fairly definitive but there is more relevant information. According to what David Clarke provided, “This is set out clearly in the attached policy document from 1997, written by Pope's line manager, that says any follow-up investigations that were required were carried out by the DI55 intelligence staff and/or the Royal Air Force.”

In still another document that came from official sources, and of which I now have a copy, it says:

Mr. Pope at one time served as EO (Band D) in the Secretariat Air Staff [a junior civil servant grade] ... [and] left Sec(AS) in 1994...and his knowledge of this issue, other than from publicly available sources, must be regarded as dated. Mr. Pope elected to describe his position as the "Head of the MoD's UFO Project", a term entirely of his own invention, and he has used his experience and information he gathered (frequently going beyond the official remit of his position) to develop a parallel career as a pundit on the topic, including writing several books, some purportedly non-fiction. Mr. Pope constantly puts himself forward in various parts of the media, solicited and unsolicited, as an "expert" (despite his lack of recent knowledge about the work carried on in the branch concerned) and seeks credit amongst other aficionados for having "forced" the MoD to reveal its "secret" files on the subject. The latter is far from the truth...

Finally, in what might be the final straw here, David Clarke provided the following, “In another document from the same period, the head of the Air Historical Branch (RAF) is even more forthright, saying ‘Far from accurately representing the Department's position, he [Pope] has sought to embellish the truth at almost every turn’.”

I suppose, that if you wish to be generous, you could say that taking the initial report and asking questions about it could be considered part of an official investigation. But that is really stretching a point and doesn’t accurately reflect the situation. The actual investigation into the reports that demanded additional work was carried about by other British government organizations and Nick Pope had virtually nothing to do with that.

But the real problem here is what Nick Pope published on his own website. Any errors, embellishments, alterations of fact can’t be blamed on the webmaster. Nick Pope approved the content. This biography said:

Nick Pope ran the British Government’s UFO project. From 1991 to 1994 he researched and investigated UFOs, alien abductions, crop circles and other strange phenomena, leading the media to call him the real Fox Mulder. His government background and his level-headed views have made him the media, film and TV industry’s go-to guy when it comes to UFOs, the unexplained and conspiracy theories.

Another aspect of this was that Nick Pope had apparently accused David Clarke of plagiarism and of being a needy, dishonest ufologist. The direct quote from David Clarke is, “Nick Pope has called me dishonest, a liar, a nut and a serial plagiarizer - despite providing absolutely no evidence for any of these things all of which are seriously defamatory.”

But this particular allegation has been debunked by Hayley Stevens a post to her blog which you can read here:

https://hayleyisaghost.co.uk/a-needy-dishonest-ufologist-revisiting-nick-popes-claims/

I mean you can disagree with someone but this is unreasonable. There is additional information contained in this post that sheds additional light on the problem. Some of the sources or documents she mentions I have seen and have copies for verification.

Philip Mantle

I’m not sure if this is piling on, or if it is relevant information. As noted above, Nick Pope claimed that he had investigated claims of alien abduction, crop circle formations or animal mutilations as part of his job at the MoD. Philip Mantle supplied the following information:

Just read this from UK documentary producer Matt Quinn. This was posted in the comments section of the martin Willis podcast:

From that reference Phillippe... "From 1991 to 1994 Mr. Pope worked as a civil servant within Secretariat (air staff). He undertook a wide range of secretariat tasks relating to central policy, political and parliamentary aspects of non-operational RAF activity. Part of his duties related to the investigation of unidentified aerial phenomena reported to the Department to see if they had any defence significance." This doesn't actually contradict what David Clark has said, and what has been 'common knowledge' for a very long time... it also completely fails to support in any way, Nick Pope's ridiculously-aggrandised claims... But in reality? I can only paraphrase Martha and the Muffins...

" _From nine to five, he had to spend his time at work His job was very boring as an office clerk The only thing that helped him pass the time away Was knowing he'd be back at Echo Beach someday_ " As we're 'buying' UK government publications (when it suits) do a search with the UK's National Archive service... And I do very much encourage you to do your own legwork; don't just take my word for it. I can tell you (as a media professional) that when 'Open Skies Closed Minds' was published it was generally received by the press as highly entertaining bollocks... riding a wave that was well in motion at the time. Just a 'jolly japes' type romp through an over-egged fantasy world... Good copy, bit of a laugh. But Nick Pope always had more in common with Dilbert than Mulder. The woman who got Nick Pope's job after him is called Kerry Philpott, and is on record stating there was no "strange phenomena section" at the MOD and that whilst Nick had been an 'EO' - Junior management grade administrator - just as she now was, she wrote "neither he nor indeed am I the head of any 'UFO' section"...

There is a chap called James Easton who is fairly well known here in Scotland as something of a 'UFOlogist'. Way back in 1999 he wrote an open letter to the MOD which posed many questions about Nick's duties and the MOD's locus in relation to various 'Fortean' phenomena... The response he got was. “The main duties of the post concern non-operational RAF activities overseas and diplomatic clearance policy for military flights abroad. A small percentage of time is spent dealing with reports from the public about alleged ‘UFO’ sightings and associated public correspondence. The MoD has not investigated a claim of alien abduction, crop circle formations or animal mutilation.” I'm sure it's now well over a decade since David Clark put that information up on his own site - over 20 since James got the response he did from the MOD and I honestly cannot tell you of anyone (except the incredibly non-credible) to whom that was in any way, shape or form a surprise. David Clark hasn't lied. - You don't have to like the guy, or not be disappointed at Nick. But David hasn't lied.  

This then, is the other side of the coin. I provided Nick Pope with a platform for his comments, and it is only fair that I supply the others with a similar courtesy. I’m inclined to say that the reader should take his or her own view of the material and decide what to believe. However, that is a somewhat weasel-worded claim for me to make. I waded into this swamp because I believed that Nick Pope should be heard, but now, having seen the other side, and although I think of Nick Pope as a friend (and can say the same about Philip Mantle and Nick Redfern), I must come down on their side of the fence.

What we see here is just another of the nasty fights that erupt in this field, though this one played out in the UK rather than here in America. If you care to comment, then you must be prepared for the consequences of that commentary. It had seemed to me, originally, that this was a bit of a fight over semantics, but it has, of course, ranged far beyond that. I don’t like the name calling or the allegations of plagiarism, having had that directed at me for a long time, but sometimes you just have to make a stand.

Here then, is what I believe to be the whole truth of the matter. And while I could say that I wish I had not involved myself in it, I would rather say that I think here is enough information that we all know the truth.

Following is one of those documents that seems to clarify the situation. I append it here for those who wish to see a little more of the evidence.

One of the documents that seems
to refute some of Nick Pope's
claims.

Did Nick Pope Investigate UFOs for the UK MoD?

 

In the UFO community, there are always disagreements and sometimes allegations are slung that have no basis in fact. I have been called a shill for the Air Force, I have been accused of working for Hector Quintanilla and Project Blue Book, and that I am an anti-abduction propagandist who writes fiction. The only truth in all that is that I do write fiction including science fiction but does that really disqualify me from UFO investigation? Wouldn’t my background in the military and my training in various fields suggest I can bring some important insights to UFO investigation?

Nick Pope

I say all this because Dr. David Clarke has again suggested that Nick Pope, sometimes described as Britain’s Fox Mulder (because the news media loves to reduce everything to the lowest common denominator) didn’t investigate anything officially. Clarke told Martin Willis, during Willis’ recent podcast, “There was a UFO desk when he was an incumbent for three years but he was just one of dozens of people who did that task and he didn’t actually investigate anything.”

Clarke went on to say that Nick Pope merely received the reports and that he then filed them. The people responsible for the investigations was the Defence Intelligence Staff, DISS. It was their job to conduct the UFO investigations that were believed to have some sort of military significance.

Clarke said, “I’ve interviewed most of the people who worked on this subject in DISS at that time and they tell me ‘well, Nick Pope didn’t have any involvement in this. We did the investigations, we didn’t share information with them because we didn’t trust them.” He meant that the civilian servants tended to leak information into the public arena which is why they didn’t trust them.

Of course, this really is nothing new. Clarke has raised these allegations in the past and Nick has refuted them in the past. This sort of thing seems to dot the UFO landscape. It doesn’t matter how many times the allegations are challenged; they seem to pop up again and again.

Philip Mantle, the force behind Flying Disk Press, and someone who can’t be seen as a skeptic, wrote to a number of UFO researcher around the world this last week:

Over the past few days social media has been buzzing regarding allegations made by Dr. David Clarke. Dr. Clarke was interviewed by Martin Willis on his podcast on the 18^th of November. At around halfway through this one hour interview Martin asked David about Nick Pope. As most of you will know Mr. Pope claims to have run the UK government’s UFO project and had officially investigated UFOs, crop circles and alien abductions as part of his MoD job. Dr. Clarke publicly stated that his is not the case and that Mr. Pope undertook no such work and there never was nor is there a UK government ‘UFO PROJECT’…

Dr. David Clarke is not the only source of information regarding Nick Pope. Personally I have been making my own enquiries which are still on-going. Although my enquiries are not yet complete I have seen and heard enough to convince me that Dr. Clarke is indeed correct. As a result just yesterday [November 25] I removed Nick Pope’s foreword for the revised edition of my book “WITHOUT CONSENT”.

Of course Nick Pope denies these allegations but now the ball is [simply] in his court. Can Nick Pope provide any official documentation that states he ran the UK government’s UFO Project? Well the MoD also claims that he did no such thing. If he can’t then is this the beginning of the end of Nick Pope?

Still, there is some smoke, but is there any fire. I particularly liked the idea that Nick present some sort of documentation. I have had the same sort of requests made of me when people wondered if I had been completely honest about my background. I provided the documentation, though a couple of times it took some convincing for the controlling agencies to release the data. I always attempt to supply the information requested to stop the rumors.

Nick Pope

I have also found that those who can’t provide the evidence tend to come up with the “I’m not going to dignify that request with any sort of response defense.” I’ve always taken that to mean that they can’t provide the evidence so they just dodge the question with this non response… Or they fall back on the old the records have been altered or have been destroyed. Huge red flags when dealing with these sorts of allegations.

I reached out to Nick Pope, who was, of course, aware of this latest brouhaha. Within minutes, I had an answer from Nick. He mentioned that this allegation had been around for years and it had been answered time and again. He pointed out that he had been interviewed on a number of high-level television, radio, and newspaper reporters and had appeared in numerous documentaries. He suggested that those reporters had vetted him and found his claims to be credible…

Well, given the state of journalism today, and knowing that documentary producers often have their own agendas, I wasn’t particularly swayed by that argument. Some might have checked, but I figure most hadn’t. They just believed what they were told because that was easier than doing any real investigation.

That wasn’t all he said. He provided a link to an official document that seemed to underscore what he claimed. You can read that here:

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200506/cmhansrd/vo060418/text/60418154.htm

If you scroll down slightly, you’ll find a question that was asked in the British parliament that seemed to suggest that Nick did investigate UFOs. It is not a ringing endorsement, but does suggest that Nick was telling the truth about his involvement, officially, in UFO investigations.

So, to answer Philip Mantle’s question, it seems that Nick did supply an official document that states he ran the project. For those who don’t want to go to all that trouble, here is that brief statement:

From 1991 to 1994 Mr. Pope worked as a civil servant within Secretariat (air staff). He undertook a wide range of secretariat tasks relating to central policy, political and parliamentary aspects of non-operational RAF activity. Part of his duties related to the investigation of unidentified aerial phenomena reported to the Department to see if they had any defence significance.

As I say, not exactly a ringing endorsement, but it the same sort of endorsement we’ve seen for Louis Elizondo and the AATIP project he might have run. We are now in a world of secrets and bureaucracies and double speak so it is hard to define the truth. At the moment we have no real answer, other than Nick did supply official documents but it didn’t go quite as far as I would have liked.

That’s not all. Since the bar was set very low, it wasn’t very difficult to overcome. Other official documents show that Nick did investigate UFOs while serving at the MoD. You can see some of them here:

https://documents.theblackvault.com/documents/ufos/UK/defe-24-1972.pdf

http://documents.theblackvault.com/documents/ufos/UK/defe-24-2086.pdf

As a final bit of evidence, Nick was interviewed for a documentary and according to tht documentary, was the spokesman for the MoD UFO program. For those interested, you can watch it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2klCuyv5Tg

I will note, for those who don’t wish to watch the whole thing, that the relevant part begins at the fifteen minute mark.

Nick also wrote, “I don't think there's rivalry between David Clarke and I. I remember Clarke from the British UFO Research Association, so we're not rivals - merely people who come at this subject from different sides of the fence: him as a ufologist, me as someone who's looked at the phenomenon as part of my government job. Obviously, it's frustrating when someone misunderstands or misrepresents my government work, but the lie that I didn't investigate UFOs for the MoD was nailed years ago, and obviously the official website of British parliament is an unimpeachable source. QED.”

This whole thing might just boil down to one man making claims about another and that man providing evidence that those claims are false. Given that this has played out long before, this might just be much ado about nothing.

Oak Island - The End is Near

The end is near, I believe. There were clues in the last episode, though I confess I didn’t pay close attention. I really no longer care about all the debris they are finding on the surface because it will not lead to a treasure… though it will lead to a solution.

 

The analysis of the ox shoes found was interesting but only because their expert was able to provide such detailed information about them. We learned that there were shoes used in the winter for better traction and shoes used in the summer to protect the hooves from rocks and pebbles. It meant that the number of shoes they had found suggested a long-term occupation and the dates for the shoes put it in the range of 1650 to 1750. I’d bet it was closer to 1750.

 

The shoes and other material suggested it was the British military who had occupied the island at the time and I have to wonder if there are some records buried in some archives that would provide some documentation for this. We also have the discovery of the pine tar pit, of the infrastructure that suggests some sort of port or nautical repair facility, and the obvious use of the triangular swamp area that would have facilitated the repair of wooden sailing ships. 

All of this leads us to the point where there is no money pit, but there was an occupation of the island for the repair of ships. True, with the British military there, someone would have had the expertise to design and build the money pit. It moves it away from pirates burying their loot to a military operation to protect something of value but that just seems to be a reach too far. The alleged system of booby traps seemed to be too complex for the builders to defeat, even if they had built them. 

We know, based on the many dives and the work of the Lagina brothers that there is some sort of underground cave system that opens to the sea. So, rather than booby traps, we have a natural phenomenon that creates the illusion of booby traps. That, and a water table that is quite high seems to be the reason that those earlier diggers at the alleged money pit were unable to defeat the water. Everything they have found this season leads us to the solution that Joy Steele proposed a number of years ago. She talked about it at length on the radio version of A Different Perspective. Once again, you can listen to our discussion here:

 https://www.spreaker.com/episode/12059035 

The second clue, and I might be speculating wildly here, is what the announcer said last night. Seems to me, as he explains the situation, he used to say that the curse required the deaths of seven before the treasure would be found. I believe last night he said there had to be seven deaths before the mystery was solved. 

The difference? Have they admitted, subtlety, that there is no treasure but just a mystery to be solved? The mystery has shifted from a search for that nonexistent treasure, but to who had built those facilities back some fifty or more years before the boys found the “money pit.” That answer seems to be the British military and I believe they abandoned Oak Island when better port and repair facilities were built on the main land and some what south of Oak Island. 

But they didn’t leave any treasure buried there.

Coast to Coast - Searching Archives

 

As you all know, I have been suggesting for years that the answers we seek about UFOs might be buried in the various official archives, in the unit histories of various military organizations and the files of private groups such as CUFOS and MUFON. Many good cases, with a great deal of information are hidden in these resources, though in most cases there is no deception involved. The cases have just been overlooked for way too long.

For example, as I was working on a book and scanning through the Project Blue Book files, something caught my attention. There were four sightings made in September 1960 that were labeled as Moon Dust. That was a classified program that was revealed in the mid-1980s when the State Department inadvertently released dozens of documents to private researchers, many of them stamped Moon Dust.

Those 1960 sightings were little more than streaks of light and were, most probably, meteors. The find was not that the sightings were important but the reference to Moon Dust in the Blue Book files was. Moon Dust was program to recover returning space debris of foreign manufacture or unknown origin. Foreign origin covered a lot of ground including, obviously, UFOs. I should point out that once the code name was compromised, it was changed, according to information received by Robert Todd in answer to a FOIA request. Not that Moon Dust had ended. Only the name had been changed. Todd requested the new name but was told that it was properly classified and could not be released to the general public. There is no indication today that the program has been discontinued.

But, to get back to the gems hidden in various files. In July 1967, Harold Washington, a 41-year-old golf pro, was traveling to Meridian, Mississippi, when his car’s engine suddenly stopped and the radio faded. In the hand written statement found in the Project Blue Book files, he said:

On the evening of 10 July 1967 at approximately 1750 hrs while proceeding South on the old Popular Springs Road just south of Mr. [redacted] home, my car suddenly coasted to a stop, and the radio went silent.  I departed my car and had taken several steps to the rear in preparation of exploring the trouble when an object of excessive size passed forward of my position and perhaps 200 – 300 feet overhead. The object itself seemed to be moving silently… The object was moving in an easterly direction, having I assumed, crossed over Popular Springs Road when I first noticed it. My first impression of the thing was that it was crashing as it appeared to be coming to earth headed for a growth of trees some several hundred yards to the left front of my location, however it tilted upward appeared to be moving to the immediate right and then accelerated rapidly at an angle almost straight up and disappeared into low… clouds. I estimate that I had the object in my vision for maybe 3 – 5 seconds. From the side view I had as it first passed overhead it resembled the cymbal attached to a drum set, and was a dirty metallic Grey in color on the underside, when it tilted upward at the tree line more of the top was visible to me and it was the deep metallic color of the bluing on a good weapon. I noticed no port holes, hatches, etc. no exhaust or heard no sounds of motivation. The flight resembled nothing I have ever witnessed before unless it likened to the sharp darting manner of a humming bird. The overall size in length and width is hard to estimate however its broadest perspective reminds me of one of my #9 green and its side view as it was descending could be compared with the length of a modest house.

After the object had disappeared my radio started again to play and I was able to start the car, however this could be coincidental as the car has been very wet for several days, it was lightly sprinkling at the time and the car has gone through heavy rains 15 or 20 minutes prior to this sighting.

Washington's UFO drawing.

Another important fact is that Washington told the investigating officers that he had a cataract or a growth of some kind that affected the vision in his right eye. Washington said that his vision in his left eye was 20/20.

In that same report, the investigation officer wrote, “Washington then noted that a heard (sic) of black angus cattle that were in a pasture on the right side of the parked automobile were spooked and were running away from the edge of the road toward the center of the field.”

Washington also said he was stopped at a point about 200 – 300 yards south of a residence and he could also see another large brick house and other buildings across the pasture to the west. There weren’t any other cars on the road and Washington could not see anyone else.

A woman, whose name was redacted in the report but is apparently Downer, and was the owner of the residence, said that she could see a small, white car parked on the road at the time of the sighting. Although she could see the car, through the trees, she also said that she didn’t see anything else and heard nothing unusual. However, she said that since her yard is surrounded by large trees with heavy foliage that she would not have seen anything in the air unless it was loud enough to catch her attention.

The search for additional witnesses failed to find anyone who had seen the object, though one person, described as a yard boy, said that he had seen a flight of three, low flying jets at about the time of the sighting.

As a side note, I have found that if you read the file carefully, and there is enough material in it, that the officers assigned to remove the names of the witnesses often miss a name or two. I had a list of all the unidentified cases in the Blue Book files, and I did find the name, Harold Washington on it. I was concerned by that, but I found one place in the Blue Book file where the officer had missed a “Washington,” and later saw the note that said “[Name redacted, but is Washington] was recontacted … by Reporting Agent, who dialed [Washington’s] home and confirmed that he was at his residence. Mrs. Jan [name redacted], wife of Harold, stated that her husband was completely sober and very frightened by the incident.”

Dr. J. Allen Hynek, who analyzed the case, provided some insight to the Air Force attitude, even at a late date. On June 4, 1968, he wrote:

Also, characteristic of this type of sighting is the statement that the object “tilted upward, accelerated, and disappeared into the clouds” – all in a matter of a few seconds. In our present scientific framework, of course, this is utterly impossible. Our technology knows of no way of accomplishing this soundlessly, or ever accomplishing it. Therefore, we either hide behind the word “unidentified” or in some cases behind “possible aircraft”, or “psychological”.  I would prefer in most single witness cases simply as a way of pleading ignorance. We have to face the fact that we do not know what causes this class of phenomenon reported so widely from this and other countries the past many years. When instances of this sort have several witnesses, the tempting thing to do is to call it mass hallucination, but this we recognize as simply another label for our own ignorance…

In summary, case should be carried as “unidentified (single witness)” since we have no evidence the person was mentally unbalanced.

This case also suggested something else that is important and demonstrates something more about the attitudes of those who were charged with investigating UFOs. The Condon Committee, that is the University of Colorado investigation, had rejected the idea of vehicle interference, claiming they knew of no way that an electromagnetic field could stall a car and then have the car spontaneously restart on its own when the electromagnetic field was removed. That is something of a misnomer. I looked at hundreds of interference cases and found that in the majority, the witness restarted the car. There are very few cases in which the car was reported to have restarted by itself. That renders the Condon Committee rejection of such cases as invalid. The drivers had to take some action.

This case was reported to the Air Force, labeled as unidentified (single witness), yet it didn’t make it to the Condon Committee for their research. It was reported to the Air Force literally within hours, so that an investigation, following the criterion set up by the Condon Committee could have been conducted. Of course, an examination of this case would have required that they reevaluate one of their conclusions. It might not have altered them in the end, but was an opportunity to do some real science.

The point here is that this is just one of those cases hidden away in various files or archives that can provide us with some clues about the nature of UFOs. That means there is good reason to review some of the research that has gone on before us.

The Curse of Oak Island - Season 8: Same Old Same Old

 

Yes, I have been sucked into the new season of The Curse of Oak Island. But I saw nothing new in it other than the Lagina brothers had to quarantine for two weeks before they were allowed to roam free in Canada. During that time others on Oak Island continued to march in the same direction that we have watched for the last several years.

Oak Island

Yeah, the guys working with metal detectors managed to find more coins on the surface of the island. Yeah, they found an old ax head that had been lost centuries ago. Yeah, they put a butterfingers diver into one of the many bore holes they have dug over the years. He found one of the gold “things” that we’ve heard about, but then dropped it so that it is now buried in the sand and dirt some 200 feet down. They may never retrieve it.

They have found evidence, substantial evidence, that there was some sort of occupation on Oak Island centuries ago. They have found structures that success some sort of port or repair facility, most likely built by the English in decades past. The coins and other material lead to that conclusion. The latest find, which might be a Chinese coin just suggests that the British traveled the world and as they did so, picked up coins and souvenirs in exotic locations.

What struck me as interesting was the find of what they thought might have been the entrance to a tunnel system that could lead to that mythical money pit.

Joy Steele

Archaeological examination showed that it was some sort of tar pit which would have been used to repair ships adding to the idea that Oak Island had served as a repair facility until better ports were built to the south.

And this takes us back to Joy Steele. You might remember her. She suggested that she had solved the mystery of Oak Island because some of the evidence reminded her of the tar kilns found all over the east coast of North America. You can read my assessment of her theory here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/03/curse-of-oak-island-nearing-solution.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2017/05/the-mystery-of-oak-island-solved-by-joy.html

You can listen to the interview I conducted with her on the A Different Perspective radio show here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/12059035

The real point here is that everything found by all the digging, metal detecting and historical research is explained by the simple fact that the English had created a facility on the island and they used it for decades. And, if there was such a facility, then the idea of pirate treasure is, well, scuttled. How would pirates sneak onto the island to create the elaborate money pit? That doesn’t even consider that a pirate wouldn’t have had the technical expertise to create the money pit.

I will note, apropos of nothing at all, that an English garrison on the island would probably have had that expertise. Given that their occupation probably lasted decades, they would have had the time to build the money pit… No, I don’t think they did, I’m just saying that the Royal Navy could have done it. Can’t think of a good reason for it, but they could have done it.

Anyway, I expect more of the same this season. Exciting finds of old coins, maybe some more jewelry and other artifacts but we have to remember the island has been occupied for centuries. Nothing found led to a treason because, frankly, there is no treasure and never was. I wish there was. I wanted there to be a treasure but sometimes reality just slaps you in the face.

Glenn Davis, First-Hand Witness... I Mean Glenn Dennis

 

It keeps happening and its still annoying. When Air Force officer James McAndrew finished his report about Roswell that dealt with the bodies, he apparently packed up everything. That material eventually ended up at the National Archives, with a note that the tapes and files had been sent by the Air Force. It provided a note of authenticity to those tapes.

I don’t believe that the Air Force conducted any those interviews. The tapes were provided by others including the Fund for UFO Research. In other words, they came from the private sector, yet the way the are displayed suggests they came from the military. I mention all this because I have become aware of another website which has posted the interview with Glenn Dennis without comment or permission. To make it all worse, if possible, they label is as “W. Glenn Davis, alleged firsthand witness to events at Roswell Army Air Force Hospital concerning recovered alien bodies.”

Glenn Dennis, Obviously.

Other than getting Dennis’ name wrong, and the name of the base wrong, they make no comment about the validity of Dennis’ testimony. It has been exposed as a hoax. Dennis told numerous lies about his involvement in the case. It was clearly invented and we, and by we, I mean a number of people attempting to verify his tale, were unable to do so. The nurse never existed, he changed her name, and when confronted about this told additional lies. You can read more about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2020/04/glenn-dennis-lies.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2011/01/glenn-dennis-revisited.html

For those interested in the truth, we really should remove Glenn Dennis from the story. He had no special knowledge, he wasn’t involved, and the tale of the child-sized coffins was probably appropriated from another witness… And we haven’t even discussed the need for child-sized coffins. Would those of any size have done the job?

Without the National Archives making this video available and creating the idea that it was the military who gathered the data, it adds a level of credibility that the Dennis testimony does not deserve. Since I was one of the initial investigators, and since my voice is one of those heard on the tape, I should know. The best thing is to remove the video so that it confuses no one else.

X-Zone Broadcast Network - Colonel Richard Weaver and the Roswell Report

For years Colonel Richard Weaver has been seen as the villain in the Roswell UFO crash tale. He was the man in charge of the Air Force investigation that culminated in that huge report that contained so much information. He was the guest on the latest edition of the A Different Perspective radio show/podcast. You can listen to both hours here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/41931979

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/41932179

Colonel Richard Weaver... Incognito.

We began with a discussion of the process that ended up with his assignment for the Air Force, and then in the details of how the investigation was conducted. For those interested in the way this manipulated by those working through Congressman Schiff, it is eye opening. You can read the details in his book found at:

https://www.amazon.com/Backstory-Roswell-Exclusive-Disclosures-Inquiry-ebook/dp/B08GY9WXCL/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=Colonel+Richard+Weaver+Backstory&qid=1605299084&sr=8-2

Although we did discuss the role that Karl Pflock played in getting Schiff to request the GAO investigation, it wasn’t the most important part of the show. Pflock, at least according to Rich, was maneuvering behind the scenes, attempting to improve his status and interest a publisher in a book deal. In fact, according to a letter that Pflock had sent to retired AFOSI agent Sheridan Cavitt, he was looking to make some money out of the deal.

We did analyze the role that Jesse Marcel played in the whole Roswell case. There are some points in Marcel’s claims, not about Roswell but about his military career, that are worrisome. Part of the trouble, I suspect, came from the notes of Bob Pratt’s 1978 interview with Marcel and the way that Pratt transcribed the tape. You can read that interview here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2013/09/jesse-marcel-sr-bob-pratt-and-interview.html

We touched on the claim that Marcel had shot down five enemy aircraft during WWII. Rich pointed out that there were records of soldiers who were gunners in aircraft who had shot down enough enemy to become “aces,” but Marcel wasn’t among them. I thought the claim might have been confused by Marcel’s claim of five Air Medals… I, and Rich, could only document two.

Captain Jesse Marcel (at the map board) briefing flight crews in the
South Pacific during the Second World War.

We also looked at the press conference held in General Ramey’s office once Marcel had brought material from Roswell to Fort Worth. I had interview Irving Newton in 1990 about his role in explaining the debris. Clearly, what is seen in the photographs is debris from a weather balloon and a rawin radar reflector. But I didn’t mention the interview that Don Schmitt had with retired Brigadier General Thomas DuBose who was also in the office. He said that the debris on the floor was not the same as the debris that had been brought from Roswell. You can read about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2018/07/thomas-dubose-and-switched-roswell.html

This, of course, lead, indirectly to a discussion of Project Mogul. Rich believes that it is a viable explanation for the debris found by rancher Mack Brazel. I do not. I’ve covered the reasons several times and you can read them here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2018/07/thomas-dubose-and-switched-roswell.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/02/national-geographics-and-ufos.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2013/12/the-project-mogul-double-standard.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2013/08/a-few-facts-about-project-mogul.html

And, since it is fun to show both sides of a tale, I will note that Tim Printy, at his website had this to say about Mogul:

http://www.astronomyufo.com/UFO/flight4.htm

And, it wouldn’t have been a well rounded two hours had we not discussed MJ-12. Here we both are on the same page. Rich provided the Air Force reasons for not accepting MJ-12 as a legitimate set of documents and I explained what I believe is the fatal flaw in the documents. You can read more about that here:

These are some of the highlights of the shows. There is much more about the Roswell case and the Air Force investigation into those events. I keep thinking of things to add. For example, we discussed the Ramey Memo, and the fact that the high-powered lab used by the Air Force to attempt to read anything on it failed, when a kid with a magnifying glass can pick out five or six words. There is a great deal of inside information in those shows and anyone interested in Roswell, regardless of which came in which they reside, will find something of interest.

Next up is William Puckett who hosts a website that publishes current UFO sightings as well as dealing with other aspects of the UFO phenomena. 

Coast to Coast - November 12, 2020 - Triangular UFOs

 

As those of you who visit here regularly know, I do something that I call chasing footnotes. Sometimes it’s just chasing references to find the original source. This latest episode came about because I wondered when the first triangular-shaped UFO had been reported. I wondered this because reports of triangles seemed to have exploded in the last few years, but this wasn’t a shape widely reported in the past.

I found several references that suggested that the first recorded triangle sighting was made in the 1890s in the Dutch East Indies. None of these sources gave any details and it took a while to track this down.

I eventually made it to David Marler’s book about Triangular UFOs: An Estimate of the Situation, but that wasn’t the end of the trail. Marler quoted Don Keyhoe who seems to be the source. Keyhoe reported on the sighting in his Flying Saucers Are Real. You can read the book here:

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/5883

Keyhoe wrote that in 1890 “several large bodies were sighted hovering over the Dutch East Indies. Most accounts described them as roughly triangular, about one hundred feet on the base and two hundred feet on the sides. But some observers thought they might be longer and narrower, with a rounded base; this would make them agree with more recent stories of cone-shaped objects with rounded tops seen in American skies.” This all the Keyhoe said about the sighting and he provides no references for us.

That wasn’t the earliest of the triangular UFO sightings, however. According to Marler, the Scientific American (vol 46 pg. 49) reported that people in Lebanon, Connecticut, on July 3, 1882, saw two luminous appearances on “the moon’s upper limb (as Fort wrote [which Marler cites as his source]). These disappeared and were replaced by two dark, triangular appearances three minutes later on the moon’s lower limb.”

I have tried to track this down but have failed. The Scientific American is on line and I have read through that issue. It is also true that I might have missed it. Depending on how important the story was it might have been just a quick, small note. And, it’s important to remember that the Scientific American is not the same as it is today. It was more of a newspaper in the 19^th century.

This, of course, showed that reports of triangular UFOs have been around for

A young Mike Rogers.

decades. It wasn’t until late in the 20^th century that they came to prominence. During the Phoenix Lights in 1999, there were sightings of a triangular UFO that moved from Nevada south toward the Phoenix area. Mike Rogers, yes, that Mike Rogers, told me he had seen the object as it passed overhead. He said that it was huge and that although he attempted to interest others in his report, they were more focused on the lights seen over the city than they were of a dark object that didn’t fit the narrative. His sighting of the triangle, and that of others, was lost in the discussion of the Phoenix Lights.

One of the more exciting sightings of a triangle seemed to be from El Paso, Texas, on August 31, 2018. The witness said that he was driving to work when he saw the strange, triangular-shaped object. He said that he thought it was weird so he grabbed his cell phone, took several pictures of it and then made a short video. Here is the link:

https://www.mufon.com/?gclid=CjwKCAiA17P9BRB2EiwAMvwNyOXZiWETw2dei50umg5USTDsWYvQfV1xGtai-kN_RL8_i4B8DQ0tvRoCMWcQAvD_BwE

However, I did reach out to Marc D’Antonio who is MUFON’s photo expert. He told me, “There’s definitely something illuminated by the sun which is also in the shot up behind some clouds… It appears to me that it could very well be a jet contrail that’s extremely foreshortened being illuminated by the sun from this particular angle... My thoughts anyway. Either way it doesn’t appear to be too mysterious. It is after all illuminated by the sun and stays in the same relative position.”  

Triangle sightings are an on-going phenomenon. According to Peter Davenport, there have been over 200 reports of triangles in the first half of 2020. Here are just a few of the sightings reported to the National UFO Reporting Center.

Peter Davenport

At 9:00 pm on Thursday October 1st, [in Cedar Rapids] I was taking out my garbage when I saw an aircraft slowly coming towards my home, west to east, going towards Mt. Vernon [Iowa]. I thought it was a helicopter but then as it came to be almost above my head, I realized it was not. It was flat metal gray, almost black, it wouldn’t be easy to see had it not had lights on it. It was triangular in shape but the points were flat, not pointed. It spanned maybe 10 feet across and was 10 feet in length. It had two bright lights on the front, like headlights, and a light on each wing, I guess, one was red and one was green. Both blink opposite of the other. It was traveling at I would say approximately 20-30 mph. It wasn’t fast. I yelled for my friend Cody to come outside when it was directly over me. It was very low, only about 6 feet above the tree outside my balcony. And the sound it made was that if a very far away jet. So oddly super quiet but very distinct. I saw no propellers, nothing moved! or it produced no wind at all and it stayed traveling at the same speed until it was out of site. A car driving by stopped to watch it go by as well, so technically 3 witnesses but Cody came and saw it just as it was passing over head. Not sure what it was. But it was not a helicopter or a plane, at least not any that I know exist. If it was a drone, it was a huge effing drone. We had completely cloud cover the sky not even 10 minutes after this happened.

Also, on October 1, from Johnson City, Tennessee, came this. I was taking my husband to work and as I’m getting closer to his job I happen to look to my left and notice this large object in the sky that looks triangular. I mean it could have been another shape but from the distance it looked like a triangle. It was roughly around 5:53 am this morning and the three big white circles of the lights were in a triangle position it was at a vertical position which I thought strange, it was very, very bright so I figured maybe a plane but then it was just sitting there and I thought that’s odd and kept looking as I’m trying to drive. It reminded me of a Christmas tree position just hanging out. I saw a little red on it at one point on the right side of the craft would be our left side... but the farther I got, the more distant it was but it never moved ... I told him we needed to stop and video tape or take a photo but we were running behind and I tried to catch it on my way back it was gone by then. The location of the object looked perhaps in a wooded area and some back roads. Just from where I saw it and the location of where I was. I wanted to report it because I’ve seen so many aircraft in my time and I’m in a military family ... this was just weird.

On October 2, three triangles were seen over Berea, KY. The witness said, “Driving home and saw three spaced apart black triangular aircrafts with white and red lights hovering still over the interstate I-75. Two of them were hovering above the strip of land which separates the north and southbound lanes and one was hovering on the outskirts of the northbound lane. There was no noise.”

On October 5, in Pensacola, a tree cutting crew said that at dusk saw the triangle that they first thought was a helicopter but when it flew overhead, they could see the black triangle shape. It had a blinking white light at the front and two red lights in the rear. He got a very good look at it before it disappeared.

I should note here that these are merely reports and haven’t been investigated thoroughly yet. And, I mentioned, these are but a few of those reports. On October 1, there were several sightings of triangles reported to NUFORC. It does seem as if they are becoming more prominent.

Coast to Coast - November 6: Hawaiian UFO Video

 

I’ve talked about multiple chains of evidence in the past, which is the suggestion that we move beyond just witness testimony. I have a sighting from just about two weeks ago, on October 24, in Hawaii that involved, not only witness testimony, but also an interesting video. This supplies us with something that can be analyzed and it corroborates what the witness saw. According to what William Puckett reported, on his website at www.ufosnw.com, the witness who hosts a podcast and lives in Honolulu, said, “I saw a possible V-shaped craft… It had lots of lights and was very large.” You can see the original video here:

https://www.ufosnw.com/newsite/v-shaped-craft-with-lots-of-lights-over-hawaii/

KHON2 in Honolulu asked, “Did you happen to see strange bright lights Saturday night? You may have been one of many who thought it looked like a plane, a meteor shower or something unexplainable…. We are told since it was traveling east, residents on the Big Island and Maui probably got a better view.”

There were suggestions from astronomers and others that this was the re-entry of a Chinese Rocket booster, as it broke up re-entering the atmosphere. There are videos on YouTube of meteors falling that can be used for comparison. I’ll put a link or two at the end of this with the compilations of meteor falls.

Puckett, in an update on October 31, said that he had shown the witness a rocket re-entry video. He reported that “This thing was its one thing,” meaning, of course, that it was a single thing and not something that was breaking up.

Others have weighed in on this. In the comments section, Jim supplied some interesting observations. Using his equipment and watching it several times, he wrote that there were more than eleven fixed, stationary lights with two that are larger and pulsed randomly at the same speed. Several of the smaller lights are in fixed positions. He concluded that they are on a single object. He believes that one of the photos that had been posted that seemed to show burning debris was the result of camera motion blur.

Another commentator, Joel Wesley Small, said that when he looked at it, he thought there was a central object and some smaller objects on its periphery. He thought that it could have been a re-entry that was disintegrating, but thought the light sources were too steady. He thought of it as unidentified.

I thought the blinking lights seemed to suggest something other than burning rocket debris. Looking at the video, I did notice the blinking lights and haven’t seen anything quite like that on the meteor compilations that I watched.

I will note here that in March 1968, the re-entry of the Zond IV did fool a few people into thinking they were looking at a cigar-shaped craft with lighted windows along the side. However, the majority of the people who saw it, understood what they were seeing. This was compared to the famous Chiles Whitted sighting from 1948 that lead to the infamous “Estimate of the Situation.” You can read about that this controversy here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2016/01/chiles-and-whitted-revisited.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2016/01/chileswhitted-and-skepticism.html

 

Following are some links to other videos of meteor falls to give you an idea of what they look like. This will provide some perspective on the Honolulu video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLM1pfgv9IE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfKZsl3YgGY

As it stands right now, the video from Hawaii is unidentified. It doesn’t look quite like the re-entries that had been seen in the past and there is a real possibility of additional videos out there. If those are located then a great deal of additional information can be gathered, and that is, after all, what science is all about.

X-Zone Broadcast Network - Ben Moss and the Socorro UFO Landing

Ben Moss was the guest this week. We talked about his book on the Socorro UFO landing case, and our investigations into it. My book about Socorro, Encounter in the Desert, came out in 2018 and Ben’s, Not of this World: The Socorro Landing with Humanoids, is available from Ben by writing bmoss6@verizon.net for an autographed copy. You can listen to the interview here:

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/41803533

The one point of disagreement was about the symbol that Police Officer Lonnie

Ben Moss

Zamora reported. While the credibility of the case does not hang in the balance, it is an interesting point. Very few UFOs are reported to have any symbols on them and the situation that created the discrepancy provides some insight into UFO investigation, at least in the 1960s. For those interested, you can read some of my comments and an FBI document about which is the correct symbol in my book and take a look at these postings:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2019/10/chasing-references-socorro-edition.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2018/09/treasure-quest-socorro-and-zamora-symbol.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2016/11/a-final-analysis-of-socorro-symbol.html

https://www.theblackvault.com/documentarchive/fbi-files-on-the-socorro-ufo-landing-april-24-1964/

We also discussed the Project Blue Book investigation into the landing case and what Lieutenant Colonel Hector Quintanilla had to say about it. Upon his retirement from the Air Force, he wrote a book about his experiences investigating UFOs. Although there are many cases in the Blue Book files in which witnesses reported some sort of entity, there are only three in which the cases weren’t written off as some sort of psychological problem. Of those three, the Socorro landing is the best.

Briefly, we talked about the claims that the case was a hoax. Like Ben, I don’t believe that a strong argument can be made for the hoax theory, though there are those who believe otherwise. I have explored those claims here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2009/10/lonnie-zamora-socorro-ufo-and-new.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2012/08/tony-bragalia-and-socorro-landing.html

We did mention an article in the MUFON Journal that Don Burleson had written. You can read it here:

http://documents.theblackvault.com/documents/MUFON/Journals/2008/November_2008.pdf

All this should give you some insight into this important UFO case. We have moved it from a single witness event into one in which there were multiple witnesses. The trouble is that those witnesses entered the arena and left without providing all the testimony necessary to elevate the status. Socorro was a missed opportunity, but given the time of the report, it is not surprising that more wasn’t done.

Next week, I’ll be talking with Colonel Richard Weaver about his official investigation into the Roswell case for the Air Force in the mid-1990s. He too, has written a book about it, and it does provide some very interesting insights into that investigation. If you have questions, append them here and I’ll get them asked.