Monday, December 28, 2020

History's Greatest Mysteries - A Quick Analysis

 

One of the starkest notes I have received about the History Channel’s History’s Greatest Mysteries, was the one that suggested the program had convinced the viewer that there was nothing alien about the Roswell UFO case. Rather than suggesting that there was a real mystery there, this correspondent believed that it had removed all the mystery from the case. I have to admit, I had some similar thoughts.

This means, that if I didn’t have a great deal of additional information, I could see where the program did nothing to advance the case. As but a single example, they bring up Project Mogul but neglect to point out that the culprit, Flight No. 4 had been cancelled. Only a cluster of balloons had been launched later in the day to lift a microphone high into the atmosphere to test its ability to detect the sounds of a large explosion. The cluster was not made up of the long array, didn’t contain the necessary rawin radar targets, and probably never actually left the confines of the White Sands Proving Ground. Such information was necessary to make an accurate assessment of the probability that Mogul was responsible for the debris found by Mack Brazel.

Mogul balloons in flight.

And, since they returned to Mogul in the last installment, and failed to mention that Flight No. 4 was not launched, as the documentation from the project director noted, I’ll mention it once again. The problem with saying that it was Flight No. 4, is that Flight No. 4 had been cancelled. You can read the various arguments, notes and documentation about it here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2008/10/more-bad-news-for-mogul.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/07/project-mogul-and-roswell.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/02/national-geographics-and-ufos.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/02/national-geographics-and-ufos.html

For those who wish even more about the Mogul answer, just type Project Mogul into the search engine on the blog and it will provide a longer list of postings about Mogul. There is also a long appendix in Roswell in the 21st Century that lays all this out in one convenient place. Just click on the cover on the left side of the blog to take you right to the book.

Another, minor problem was that Jesse Marcel talked, on camera, in a segment filmed decades ago about a press conference in General Ramey’s office on July 8, 1947. He mentioned a bunch of microphones and reporters, but the truth is, there was but a single reporter and no evidence that he, the reporter, recorded anything. I will point out that I don’t consider this a lie, just someone attempting to remember a specific event thirty or forty years after the fact. I find myself in a similar dilemma as I put together, on the Vietnam Ground Zero blog, my experiences as a helicopter pilot and aircraft commander in Vietnam. I try to be accurate, but I’m just a little bit worried that some of the memories have been confabulated, meaning, after all these years, some of those memories are jumbled together. It’s not a lie, just a bit of confusion

Frank Kaufmann

I was astonished, and disappointed, that they trotted out Frank Kaufmann to make some sort comments about the alien nature of the discovery. Those who visit here regularly know that Frank Kaufmann had invented his involvement in the Roswell case. He had told us, all who would listen, that he had been a master sergeant trained in intelligence. When his true military career was discovered, we learned he had been a staff sergeant trained in administration. The documents he had presented to prove his intelligence background had been forged. He lied about who he was and what he had been doing. You can read more about Kaufmann here:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/09/more-on-frank-kaufmann.html

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2007/09/how-did-frank-kaufmann-slip-through.html

Once again, for those who wish more information, and to understand the evolution of the Kaufmann testimony, just type Frank Kaufmann into the search engine. There are even examples of the documents that he forged. Kaufmann had been thoroughly discredited and I’m astonished that they would use any footage of him spinning his wild tales.

And there was Glenn Dennis, whose tale unraveled when the nurse couldn’t be found. He spun a great story, but it was no truer than those told by Frank Kaufmann. The postings about Glenn Dennis can be found here (and they include links to other articles as well):

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2020/05/x-zone-broadcast-network-tom-carey-and.html

But the real point of the programs was to introduce what have been called Jesse Marcel’s Journal. This was a document found by the grandchildren among the papers left by Jesse Marcel. It covered the period that included the date of the crash of the object near Roswell, New Mexico.

As I have mentioned, last February I was in Fort Worth to film a segment on the Ramey Memo. Although I was there to talk about the Ramey Memo, I spent several hours in front of the camera talking about all aspects of the Roswell UFO crash case.

During the interview, the subject of Marcel’s Journal came up. I knew a little about it, of course, and there were some people that I could ask about it if I wanted to know more information. I reported everything I knew, until we reached February. Then, I was given additional information on the condition I would say nothing until the segment about the Journal aired.

I was told that the majority of the Journal contained nothing other than the mundane musings of someone who was keeping a journal. It ran from 1946 until 1948 or 49, so that it covered the critical days in 1947. It was filled with quotes from movies and books, and things like that but made no reference to the UFO crash. In fact, it seemed to skip over the critical days in July but there is nothing really significant in that. I mean, the Journal is not a daily record, but the periodic writings of the author.

There were areas that seemed to be in code. These, apparently, are the sections written in block lettering as opposed to cursive used in the majority of the Journal. We learned, during the program, that they had submitted the Journal to forensic analysis to test the paper and ink. Of course, both the paper and ink were from the proper time, meaning that the Journal was written at the times noted in it. Since we had a known provenance for the Journal, this seemed to be a wasted effort. No one really thought it was some kind of fake, given the way it was found.

The real revelation was when the Journal was given to a handwriting expert. She pointed out that whoever wrote the entries in cursive was the same person who wrote the sections written in block letters. The “code” then, maybe hidden in those musings because of the strange mixture in upper- and lower-case letters in those few pages of block printing. But then, it was noted, based on an analysis of the handwriting of Jesse Marcel and the writing in this Journal, that Marcel was not the author.

That seemed to suck some of the importance out of the Journal. While it was found in Marcel’s military records, we don’t know who wrote it or why. The thing that stuck me about it was that it appears to be quotes from various sources. This is something that aspiring writers do. Find a sentence or a paragraph or a saying that has some sort of appeal and copy it.

Later, using samples of handwriting by various officers, they attempted to match the handwriting of one of those officers to that in Journal. They keep suggesting that Patrick Saunders, the base adjutant in 1947, was the number two man on the base behind Colonel Blanchard. That simply is not accurate. Both Payne Jennings and Robert Barrowclough were the numbers two and three in Roswell at the time. There were eighteen lieutenant colonels assigned to the base in 1947, and each of them outranked Saunders. This doesn’t diminish his position, only clarifies it.

In letters sent to me, and supplied to the production company, Saunders’ daughter provided an insight into his role in Roswell in 1947. Saunders, according to what he said, had altered records, funded parts of the recovery operation by disguising the missions as navigational problems and cross-country training. That there was wreckage or bodies on the aircraft were unimportant in the accounting for the money spent. The training mission paid for the cost of moving people, equipment and wreckage around.

Ironically, the producers missed an obvious clue to the importance of what Saunders wrote, even as they used the samples of his handwriting to compare with the writing in the Journal. On the flyleaf to The Truth about UFO Crash at Roswell, Saunders wrote, “Here’s the truth and I still haven’t told anybody about anything!” He then signed it.

That page, labeled as “Damage Control,” contained a paragraph about what had happened in Roswell. It said:

Files were altered. So were personal records, along with assignments and various codings and code words. Changing serial numbers ensured that those searching later would not be able to locate those who were involved in the recovery. Individuals were brought into Roswell from Alamogordo, Albuquerque, and Los Alamos. The MPs were a special unit constructed of military police elements from Kirtland, Alamogordo, and Roswell. If the men didn’t know one another, or were separated after the event, they would be unable to compare notes, and that would make the secret easier to keep.

After the impact site was cleaned, the soldiers debriefed, and the bodies and the craft removed, silence fell. It would not be broken for almost forty-five years.

While they were looking for a code hidden in the journal, and gathering samples of the handwriting of some of the officers, they had Saunders verifying the information on that page and by extension, what was written in the book.

Patrick Saunders' note on the flyleaf of
The Truth about the UFO Crash at Roswell.


The other thing that struck me was the selection of the officers whose handwriting was used for comparisons. I think they selected those they did because they had samples of that handwriting. They didn’t, for example, find samples for James Breece, who worked directly for Marcel. I have wondered that if Marcel “inherited” the Journal as he was cleaning out his desk, or his office, when he was transferred. The Journal might have been left by one of those working in the Intelligence Office with Marcel.

I also have to wonder what the point was to bring in some of the other reported crashes. They provide nearly no other information about any of them, leaving the viewer with more unnecessary questions. The alleged crash, on the Plains of San Agustin comes down to a single witness that no UFO researcher ever interviewed. The tale is traced to Barney Barnett, but there is no corroboration for it. Every other person who talks about it, is second hand, with their information coming from Barnett.

There are several other things that could be mentioned here. For example, I have to wonder, as have others, when they recreated the Marcel photograph, why is the man wearing a Marine corporal’s uniform?

You also have to wonder who performed the fact check for the episode. There were lots of little mistakes that could easily have been corrected, had anyone asked a question or two. One of the things I would have pointed out is that anything Kaufmann said about the case was made up byKaufmann.

On the whole, I believe the show didn’t follow through on several key points. What was learned by Gene Cooper and this analysis of the Ramey Memo? All we had was the preliminary work done in Fort Worth. What was learned once he had an opportunity to analyze the Memo at length.

Who decided to bring in some of the “witnesses,” that were interviewed? Frank Kaufmann and Glenn Dennis were not involved regardless of what they claimed later in life. Each has been caught telling lies, and in Kaufmann’s case, forging documents.

In the next few days, I hope to get a transcript of Barbara Dugger’s interview up on this blog. This is the March 1991 interview that Don Schmitt and I conducted. Her story was not nearly as robust as it is now… and, of course, we have the written document created by Inez Wilcox about the Sheriff’s involvement.

And, finally, why didn’t they mention that Flight No. 4, according to the documentation had been cancelled? Without that flight, there was no Mogul array to scatter debris on the Brazel ranch… not to mention that Marcel, among many others, would have recognized the debris left by Mogul as neoprene balloons and radar targets and not something built on another planet.

The point is the show could have been so much better. Instead, we learned that Jesse Marcel didn’t write the Journal, Patrick Saunders’ important note was used for comparison purposes rather as a signed validation of much of the information of a cover up, and we don’t have a final word on the Ramey Memo... and this is just my preliminary thoughts.

23 comments:

09rja said...

A big notion of the episode was that Marcel Sr. held something back in the interviews he gave back in the late 70's & 80's. I find that to be unlikely. He (for example) admitted to In Search of... in 1980 that what he found was "not anything from this Earth". So isn't the cat out of the bag at that point?

They missed a chance for some real comedy. When they went to Marcel's old house in Louisiana....I would have paid some real money to see them say to the current owner: Hi! We are here from the History Channel....and we want to tear apart your water heaters to find some fragments of an alien spacecraft that a previous owner may have left in them. Ok?

The look would have been priceless. Of course, I think it's safe to say: I doubt the house has the same water heaters. Longest I've ever had one last on me is about 20 years. (Even the older ones didn't last forever. Seems like the older the appliance is....the longer it lasts.)

Louis Nicholson said...

Wow, I'm really intrigued. I would love more info on the Patrick Saunders and memo issues you raised. Hopefully you can give us updates on what you learn about these issues in the near future.

As far as Calvin Parker is concerned, I just do not believe that Marcel told him he hid alien debris in a water heater or anywhere else. Also, as 09rja said its extremely doubtful the same water heater would have been in the house all this time. Furthermore, it may have been a crime to use false pretenses to gain entry into the house to take property as was apparently attempted.

Robert W said...

Is there anywhere that all 7 pages Saunders highlighted in the book can be seen?

Is there anywhere that the Marcel Journal is hosted, so amateur codebreakers can have a look at all the block text, as it was written?

E8 said...

It's explained what I believed happened in my thread here:
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1177739/pg1

Throughout Mogul, service/research/test flights were being launched out of Alamogordo in between full Mogul arrays. This was not a fully developed program and testing was still going by Charles Moore and others when taken to Alamogordo. If you want to use anything out of Albert Crary's journal entry, you can see that's only more support that fully equipped Mogul arrays were not the only thing being launched. This broadens the opportunity for something else crashing, something Earthly and unincredible. Something made up of the EXACT debris found by Mac Brazel- Foil, sticks, rubber, paper. Balloons and radar targets.

Lemurian said...

Why do you wrote that there are no Hints to Roswell, the Plains of San Augustin and Barney Barnett? You know that Gerald Anderson, his Brother, Uncle and so were on the Plains Crashsite and they saw the crashed Spaceship, the Aliens and Barney Barnett.

KRandle said...

E8 -

The problem here is that you only present part of the picture. Moore said that Flight No. 4, did fly but that it was launched at 2 or 3 in the morning. He made the change because a weather front moved through Alamogordo about 6 in the morning, and that change would have taken the balloons in a direction different from that needed to get it to the Brazel ranch. And, Crary's diary mentioned they launched a cluster of balloons later that day. The make up of these clusters was published in various documents.

Finally, you quote from the Roswell Daily Record interview with Brazel that talked about the make up of the material brought into the office, but forget to mention the quote attributed to Brazel in which he said that he had found weather observation devices on other occasions but this was nothing like that... but had it been anything launched from Alamogordo at the time, it would have been exactly like that.

I do not wish to get into another long, drawn out discussion on this. My position, and the counter arguments to Mogul are laid out here (just type Mogul into the search engine) and in the book Roswell in the 21st Century.

KRandle said...

Lemurian -

I debated about posting this because it just reveals your ignorance of the case. Really? You cite Gerald Anderson, the man who was caught in multiple lies, who forged documents, changed his story significantly when challenges to it were made, and who obviously wasn't there, nor were any of his relatives... And Stan Friedman knew this but said nothing about it.

All the witness testimony cited is traceable back to Barnett... His wife's diary mentions nothing about it, which should be considered a significant fact. If you have any information about a crash on the Plains of San Agustin (please note the proper spelling), then there really is nothing left to discuss.

E8 said...

Simply put, wouldn't most agree that- rubber strips, tinfoil, tough paper, sticks, scotch tape, eyelets, all described by Brazel in 1947 point to the in-between Mogul service/test flight not an alien spacecraft? In particular the one drawn by Charles Moore in the Roswell Report? How does Marcels description not meet those same standards? "Small wood-like beams, tinfoil, paper" Where are the alien materials? It just happened to be constructed the same way as human constructed radar targets of the period?

Brazel said:
"...two weather balloons on the ranch, but that what he found this time did not in any way resemble either of these."
I've explained this. Two that were likely a single balloon, radar target, and measuring equipment that were intact and relatively small. The ones like were photographed and posted in newspapers during the time. The Mogul program, including in-between service/research/test flights, were large. It would have been 3 or 4 times larger than the he ones found previously and was broken apart and scattered over the desert. No, he never found weather observation balloons in that state.

Charles Moore said in his signed Statement of Witness in The Roswell Report:
"I can think of no other explanation for Roswell than one of our early June service flight balloons "
There's your answer.

KRandle said...

E8 -

You simply ignore the descriptions of the material which do not meet your standards. Mack Brazel showed debris so Floyd and Loretta Proctor. She told Don Schmitt and me that the pencil-sized debris would not burn when Brazel tried to do that. Bill Brazel told us that he found debris that was as light as balsa but so touch he couldn't get carve a sliver with his pocket knife and suggested something that sounded like fiber optics... Tommy Tyree told us that the debris area was so thick with debris that the sheep refused to cross it. So, we do have descriptions of material that was certainly unavailable in 1947. I could add other descriptions given to us by various witnesses (those who held it or saw it) including what Jesse Marcel told others in 1947.

Charles Moore manipulated the data, changed the words of Albert Crary and flat out lied about some of the things he said. The drawings of the array trains that have appeared in various books are inaccurate for the New Mexico launches. Rather than 600 feet long, they had been reduced by a third. He said that Flight No. 4 was launched in the pre-dawn hours, in violation of the regulations under which they operated. Even though Crary wrote that the flight was canceled, Moore said that it was the explanation.

Crary's notes also said they launched a cluster of balloons, which was made up of neoprene weather balloons and might have included rawin targets. There is no evidence that this cluster ever left the confines of the White Sands Proving Grounds, and even Moore's own calculations for the winds aloft didn't put it on the Brazel ranch. There was nothing in any of those flights that wouldn't have been recognizable by any of those involved includig Brazel and Marcel. Several weather balloons attached to one another is not so extraordinary that they wouldn't have seen them as weather balloons... Oh, and Sheridan Cavitt told Don and me that he had never been involved in the recovery of any balloon.

So, I could go on, but suggest you take a look at the long discussion of Mogul that appears in Roswell in the 21st Century.

E8 said...

I'm not ignoring the properties of the materials at all. I covered it in my thread. Why the small members were hard to cut and burn? Read my thread, the possibility is in there.

Amazing alien materials with properties that resist cutting or deforming yet are suspiciously discovered scattered across a large area of desert broken apart?
Why is it typical of believers in this case skip right over the actual materials of rubber, foil, parchment, eyelets, scotch and other tape? Why can't they admit it's just a massive coincidence to them that an alien spacecraft is constructed the same as balloons and radar targets? They do this every time.
Before these "amazing" properties, talk about the actual material for a second. I'll make it easy, I'll use Marcel's simplier description of tinfoil, small sticks, and paper. Again, it's only a coincidence that these three materials just so happen to be the exact same materials we use as humans to make radar targets launched 90 miles away during this exact time period in June 1947? The service/test flight that crashed could have been launched any day in early June for all we know. Brazel says he didn't walk up on it until June 14th.

Crary's mentioning of that particular flight wasn't necessarily the flight that crashed. As I said, use that entry in his journal that in between service/test flights were being launched and not recorded. Flights were trending towards Roswell as reported and the Air Coordinating Commity had air traffic safety concerns. In fact, a full Mogul flight #5 landed 25 miles outside of Roswell because of prevailing winds. So other flights were absolutely landing in areas surrounding Roswell.

Why haven't Mogul service/research/test flights been address and discussed to any length in these 21st century writings?

KRandle said...

E8-

And around we go. Bill Brazel talked about fiber optics... Bill Rickett talked about light weight material that was tougher than cold rolled steel...

Actually, he would have found it earlier because the field in which the debris was discovered was one of the places where they could water the live stock. Bill Brazel said that his father was in that field almost every day.

Oh, and for we writers in the 21st Century, how about you look at the book, Roswell in the 21st Century where many of these points about Mogul are addressed.

09rja said...

You simply ignore the descriptions of the material which do not meet your standards. Mack Brazel showed debris so Floyd and Loretta Proctor. She told Don Schmitt and me that the pencil-sized debris would not burn when Brazel tried to do that. Bill Brazel told us that he found debris that was as light as balsa but so touch he couldn't get carve a sliver with his pocket knife and suggested something that sounded like fiber optics... Tommy Tyree told us that the debris area was so thick with debris that the sheep refused to cross it. So, we do have descriptions of material that was certainly unavailable in 1947. I could add other descriptions given to us by various witnesses (those who held it or saw it) including what Jesse Marcel told others in 1947.

Charles Moore manipulated the data, changed the words of Albert Crary and flat out lied about some of the things he said. The drawings of the array trains that have appeared in various books are inaccurate for the New Mexico launches. Rather than 600 feet long, they had been reduced by a third. He said that Flight No. 4 was launched in the pre-dawn hours, in violation of the regulations under which they operated. Even though Crary wrote that the flight was canceled, Moore said that it was the explanation.

Crary's notes also said they launched a cluster of balloons, which was made up of neoprene weather balloons and might have included rawin targets. There is no evidence that this cluster ever left the confines of the White Sands Proving Grounds, and even Moore's own calculations for the winds aloft didn't put it on the Brazel ranch. There was nothing in any of those flights that wouldn't have been recognizable by any of those involved includig Brazel and Marcel. Several weather balloons attached to one another is not so extraordinary that they wouldn't have seen them as weather balloons... Oh, and Sheridan Cavitt told Don and me that he had never been involved in the recovery of any balloon.
~KRandle

If you are going to examine Charles Moore's statements....you have to do the same with the people on the other side of the aisle.....starting with Loretta Proctor. The fact is: her story changed over the years.

KRandle said...

09rja -

There is a difference between Loretta Proctor and Charles Moore. Moore lied but Proctor confabulated.

In this case we go back to Proctor's original statements and compare them with her later statements to see what changes have been made... and see if we can establish what the problem is. But the fact is, her original statement and her core story remained basically the same, and it was corroborated by others.

Moore just changed the data, lied about the launch of Flight No. 4 as more evidence was found, and manipulated the data so that data confirmed his story. Crary's diary, among other documentation, showed that Moore was lying.

09rja said...

It's interesting when stories in this get the euphemism "confabulation" (vs. just outright lies).....and when they don't.

KRandle said...

09rja -

Simply a matter of definition... Moore was caught lying... changing data to fit his scenario and Loretta Proctor believed what she was saying was the truth, even though it is clear that her testimony was contaminated by later published and broadcast information.

We can say that Frank Kaufmann lied and Glenn Dennis lied and Gerald Anderson lied... all who told great stories about first-hand involvement that were later found to have no basis in fact.

09rja said...

I'm not sure how she could have "believed what she was saying was the truth" given some of her statements.

But to avoid another food fight over witnesses I'll just say (as the French would) vive la différence.

KRandle said...

Then clearly, you to not understand the concept of confabulation.

BTW - I'm always looking at the testimonies of all those involved to ensure that we can understand what happened... and his is why we all know that Frank Kaufmann, Gerald Anderson and Glenn Dennis lied. No, not confabulated, lied.

09rja said...

Yeah, I understand it. I don't think you do actually. There is no way Loretta Proctor's (ever changing) story could be written off to "confabulation".

E8 said...

I'm not going around in circles I'm asking a direct question that never gets answered, including here. Again, I find it extremely odd that it's just a coincidence that an alien spacecraft is built using foil, sticks, paper, tape, and eyelets just like balloons and radar targets are on Earth. You would think there would be a single material unrelatable to anything human. Why can no one, including yourself, own up this which would have to be fact for the other to fall in place?

As far as fiber optics, there's a historic path to follow that shows fiber optics began in the 1840s with the discovery of light moving along a path with water. It continued to grow through the decades eventually using light to send information and the manufacturing of glass fibers. Fiber optics didn't spontaneously appear from nowhere with no explanation. There's a beginning.

I can see this outlet is not getting anywhere and simple questions go unanswered here as well.

RWE said...

Well, I think they did report the results of the scanning of the Ramey message (it appeared to be a telex message, not a memo. I have written a great many of both). A curious aspect is that it did not have any prominent classification markings, which you would expect if it was something as earth shaking as is being asserted.

They reported that the highly sophisticated scanning technique analyzed the fuzzy wolds and produced even fuzzier words. Any "better" scan you would be looking at the molecular level.

They were not using a image enhancement program of the type that can look at a plate of spaghetti and produce the preamble to the US Constitution. They were just getting an even more detailed look at the fuzzy words.

KRandle said...

E8 -

I have addressed the issue of the sticks and paper reported in the Roswell Daily Record for years. I covered in Roswell in the 21st Century. We have witnesses who handled the debris that suggest something more substantial than sticks and paper and tape.

I did not say that fiber optics appeared out of no where. I said that Bill Brazel, in describing some of the material that he found, said that it had the properties of fiber optics which were not available in 1947.

I also attempted to make it clear that though witnesses used terms with which they were familiar, it didn't mean that the debris was made of those things. Brazel said that one of the pieces was light, like balsa wood, but so touch he couldn't get a shaving off it. You need to review some of those older reports which were based on first-hand testimony. Bill Brazel described for me, the three items that he found, and none of them would be considered to be part of a balloon array.

RWE -

I was there, in Fort Worth, as we made the scans of the Ramey Memo. When Gene Cooper left, after we had completed the word there, he was on his way home to analyze the results using his laboratory facilities. There was nothing in the program to suggest what he might have found there... just what we were able to see while still in Fort Worth.

E8 said...

Bill Brazel told the story after the development of fiber optics! Where's Mac Brazels mention in 1947? That would be impressive. Impressive and expected of something truly from outer space. Where is Brazels mention of anything not of Earth during his entire interview on July 9 1947?  During a time he was trying to win a reward? Surely this would be mentioned. These properties keep being talked about 30 years later, but nothing in 1947. Brazel was the first to handle and gather the debris and would have know then.

Of course this military coercion story is created to deflect from the truth in Mac Brazels story in 1947. Every piece of debris he described is human made. This attempted branch of the story makes no sense when approached logically. He was to support the weather balloon story told by the military, but says it's not a weather balloon in his story?

Sorry, but I don't believe in he said she said coupled with no actual proof. Everybody lies, that's a fact. As the saying goes, the burden of proof lies with the claimant. In particular a claimant of these incredible findings.

I'll leave it there.

KRandle said...

E8 -

Well, there is no evidence that a Mogul balloon was responsible. Dr. Crary said the flight was cancelled. And the cluster of balloons was just that, a cluster and not an array. The only thing you have is the statement published in the Daily Record, which is contradicted by Brazel himself...

Frank Joyce said that Brazel made a comment to him about the little green men in 1947.

And, since neither you nor I talked to Mack Brazel, you don't know what all he might have said. Not to mention that the material found by Bill Brazel and shown to his father was said to be some of that contraption he had found.

But what I don't understand is how you can reject the notes in Dr. Crary's diary which eliminates Mogul from the discussion... Or why you would accept the lies told by Charles Moore (and we can document those lies) so that he can place the non existent flight no. 4 near the ranch.